NEDARIM 77 - Dedicated by Mrs. G. Kornfeld for the Yahrzeit of her mother, Mrs. Gisela Turkel (Golda bas Chaim Yitzchak Ozer), on 25 Av. Mrs. Turkel was an exceptional woman with an iron will who loved and respected the study of Torah.

1)

(a)What She'eilah do we ask with regard to the Mishnah in Shabbos 'Mafirin Nedarim b'Shabbos v'Nish'alin li'Nedarim she'Hen l'Tzorech Shabbos'?

(b)Beside the fact that Hafaras Nedarim does not require a Chacham or three Hedyotos (ordinary people) like Hataras Nedarim does, why else might it differ from Hataras Nedarim in this regard?

(c)Rav Zuti cited a Beraisa that requires Tzorech Shabbos by Hafaras Nedarim, too. How did Rav Ashi prove him wrong from our Mishnah?

1)

(a)We ask with regard to the Mishnah in Shabbos 'Mafirin Nedarim b'Shabbos v'Nish'alin li'Nedarim she'Hein l'Tzorech Shabbos' - whether 'le'Tzorech Shabbos' pertains to the Reisha too, or whether it is confined to the Seifa.

(b)Beside the fact that Hafaras Nedarim does not require a Chacham or three Hedyotos (ordinary people) like Hataras Nedarim does, it might also differ from Hataras Nedarim in this regard - inasmuch as its time is limited until the end of the day.

(c)Rav Zuti cited a Beraisa that requires Tzorech Shabbos by Hafaras Nedarim, too. Rav Ashi proved him wrong however, from our Mishnah - which says 'ad she'Techshach' (implying that until nightfall, one may make Hafaras Nedarim, even though we are speaking about Nedarim that are not Tzorech Shabbos [because just before nightfall, no Hafarah is Tzorech Shabbos]).

2)

(a)How do we reconcile Rav Zuti's Beraisa with our Mishnah?

(b)Which Tana'im holds that Hafaras Nedarim requires Tzorech Shabbos?

(c)What is the Halachah? Does Hafaras Nedarim require Tzorech Shabbos or not?

2)

(a)We reconcile Rav Zuti's Beraisa with our Mishnah - by citing a Machlokes Tana'im in this matter, and that the Tana of Rav Zuti's Beraisa holds like the other Tana.

(b)The Tana'im who hold that Hafaras Nedarim requires Tzorech Shabbos - are Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah and Rebbi Elazar b'Rebbi Shimon, who hold that one has twenty-four hours in which to make Hafaras Nedarim.

(c)The Halachah is like the Tana of our Mishnah - that one only has until nightfall to make Hafaras Nedarim, in which case, Hafaras Nedarim will not require Tzorech Shabbos.

3)

(a)Does the Mishnah in Shabbos' ruling 've'Nish'alin li'Nedarim l'Tzorech ha'Shabbos' apply even if there was time to annul them before Shabbos?

(b)Why does Rav Yosef want to restrict the concession to annul Nedarim on Shabbos to a Yachid Mumcheh, but not to three Hedyotos?

(c)How does Abaye prove him wrong? Which three cases does he cite as precedents?

3)

(a)The Mishnah in Shabbos' ruling 'v'Nish'alin li'Nedarim l'Tzorech ha'Shabbos' - applies even if there was time to annul them before Shabbos.

(b)Rav Yosef want to restrict the concession to annul Nedarim on Shabbos to a Yachid Mumcheh, but not to three Hedyotos - because it resembles judging on Shabbos, which Chazal forbade.

(c)Abaye proves him wrong however - from the fact that we permit Hataras Nedarim standing, through relatives and at night-time (all of which are forbidden when judging).

4)

(a)Rebbi Aba Amar Rav Huna Amar Rav 'Halachah Mefirin Nedarim ba'Laylah'. On what grounds do we query this statement?

(b)How do we therefore amend it?

(c)What did Rav Huna reply when Rebbi Aba asked him whether Rav really said that?

(d)What did Rebbi Aba mean when he then asked Rav Huna whether he meant 'Ishtik' or 'Shasi'?

4)

(a)Rebbi Aba Amar Rav Huna Amar Rav 'Halachah Mefirin Nedarim ba'Laylah'. We query this statement - on the grounds that this Halachah already appears in our Mishnah 'Nadrah b'Lelei Shabbos' (and does not therefore require an Amora to repeat it).

(b)So we amend it - to read 'Halachah Nish'alin ba'Laylah'.

(c)When Rav Aba asked Rav Huna whether Rav really said that - he replied 'Ishtik' (meaning that Rav remained silent when he [Rav Huna] mentioned this Halachah to him).

(d)When Rebbi Aba then asked Rav Huna whether he meant 'Ishtik' or 'Shasi' - he meant to ask him whether Rav's silence denoted that he disagreed with him and that he hoped to silence him with his own silence, or rather that he agreed with him (as if to offer him a drink for his fine Chidush).

5)

(a)According to a different text, it was Rav Huna who was questioning Rebbi Aba's motive for querying him. What did he then mean by 'Ashkayan O Ashtikan'?

(b)How did Rav Ika bar Avin resolve Rebbi Aba's question (according to the alternative text, it is an independent statement)?

(c)What is 'Kituna d'Bei Rav'?

5)

(a)According to a different text, it was Rav Huna who was questioning Rebbi Aba's motive for querying him. By 'Ashkayan O Ashtikan' he meant very much the same as according to the previous explanation - whether he (Rebbi Aba) meant to silence him, because he did not consider it feasible that Rav should have said such a thing, or that he agreed with him (as if to offer him a drink for his fine Chidush).

(b)Rav Ika bar Avin resolves Rebbi Aba's question (according to the alternative text, it is an independent statement) - from Rav himself, who told Rabah in the Kituna d'Bei Rebbi that 'Omed, Yechidi and 'ba'Laylah are Kasher by Hataras Nedarim.

(c)'Kituna d'Bei Rav' is - the room of the Beis-ha'Medrash.

77b----------------------------------------77b

6)

(a)Rava Amar Rav Nachman lists all the leniencies of Hataras Nedarim over judging, including that of performing it standing. How do we reconcile this with Raban Gamliel, who got off his donkey and sat on the ground in order to annul someone's Neder?

(b)What has one got to do with the other?

(c)We do not agree with the Rashba. What leniency does the Rashba come up with, based on the ruling 'Poschin ba'Charatah'?

6)

(a)Rava Amar Rav Nachman lists all the leniencies of Hataras Nedarim, over judging, including that of performing it standing. Raban Gamliel, who got off his donkey and sat on the ground in order to annul someone's Neder - holds 'Ein Poschin ba'Charatah', whereas Rav Nachman follows the opinion of those Tana'im who hold 'Poschin ba'Charatah' ...

(b)... because, since Raban Gamliel maintains, 'Ein Poschin ba'Charatah', then he would need to find a Pesach, which is far more difficult, and requires concentration (for which one needs to sit).

(c)We do not agree with the Rashba, who, based on the ruling 'Poschin ba'Charatah' - holds that even when the Chacham wishes to annul a Neder with a regular Pesach, he is also permitted to do so standing.

7)

(a)Rava seemed rather surprised at what they used to do in Eretz Yisrael. What did the Rabanan instruct the son of Rav Huna bar Avin to do after annulling his Neder?

(b)How did they derive this from the Pasuk in Ki Setzei "v'Chi Sechdal Lindor, Lo Yiheyeh B'cha Chet"?

7)

(a)Rava seemed rather surprised at what they used to do in Eretz Yisrael, where the Rabanan - after annulling the Neder of Rav Huna bar Avin's son, instructed him to pray for forgiveness for having declared a Neder.

(b)They derived this from the Pasuk "v'Chi Sechdal Lindor, Lo Yiheyeh Becha Chet", from which we extrapolate 'Ha Lo Chadalta, Ika Chet'!

8)

(a)We learned in a Berasisa 'ha'Omer l'Ishto Kol Nedarim she'Taduri, I Efshi she'Taduri', or 'Kol Nedarim she'Taduri, Ein Zeh Neder, Lo Amar Klum'. Assuming the future tense of 'she'Taduri' to be literal, what does this Beraisa mean to say?

(b)Which of the cases in the Beraisa must have been learned erroneously, according to this interpretation?

(c)What will be the Din if he says 'Yafeh Asis', 'Ein Kamosech' or 'Im Lo Nadart, Madirech Ani'?

(d)On what grounds is the Hakamah invalid in the Reisha and valid in the Seifa?

8)

(a)We learned in a Berasisa 'ha'Omer la'Ishto Kol Nedarim she'Taduri, I Efshi she'Taduri', or 'Kol Nedarim she'Taduri, Ein Zeh Neder, Lo Amar Klum'. Assuming the future tense of 'she'Taduri' to be literal - this Beraisa is teaching us that if a husband upholds his wife's past Nedarim by annulling future ones (by inference), his Kiyum is invalid.

(b)According to this interpretation - the case of 'Ein Zeh Neder' (which implies Nedarim that she already declared) must have been learned erroneously, since the Tana is referring to future Nedarim, as we just explained.

(c)If he says 'Yafeh Asis', 'Ein Kamosech' or 'Im Lo Nadart, Madirech Ani' - his Hakamah is valid.

(d)The Hakamah is invalid in the Reisha - because it is not a Lashon of Hakamah, and valid in the Seifa - because it is.

9)

(a)How will we explain the previous Beraisa if we want to retain the case of 'Ein Zeh Neder'?

(b)Why does the Tana then use the future tense?

(c)According to this interpretation, why is a Lashon that applies by inference valid by Hakamah but not by Hafarah?

9)

(a)If we want to retain the case of 'Ein Zeh Neder' - then we will have to explain that the Tana of the Beraisa is speaking about Hafarah in the Reisha, which is not valid because this is not a Lashon of Hafarah.

(b)The Tana uses the future tense - even though it is referring to the past, because this is common practice among the Tana'im.

(c)According to this interpretation, a Lashon that applies by inference is valid by Hakamah but not by Hafarah - by virtue of the fact that Kiyum by thinking alone is valid, whereas Hafarah is not (as we shall see later).

10)

(a)The Tana in a Beraisa forbids a man to say to his wife on Shabbos 'Mufar Lechi, Batel Lechi'. What then, should he say?

(b)What is the reason for this?

(c)Why can it not be because of a decree on account of Hataras Nedarim, which is basically forbidden on Shabbos?

(d)What does Rebbi Yochanan comment on this Beraisa?

10)

(a)The Tana in a Beraisa forbids a man to say to his wife on Shabbos 'Mufar Lechi, Batel Lechi'. What he should say is - 'Tli v'Ichli, Tli u'Shesi', and the Neder is Batel automatically.

(b)The reason for this is - because like in many other issues regarding Shabbos, wherever it is possible to effect a change from the way that one does it on weekdays, one should do so.

(c)The reason cannot be because of a decree on account of Hataras Nedarim, which is basically forbidden on Shabbos - because Hataras Nedarim in this case would be permitted too, since it is a case of Tzorech Shabbos.

(d)Rebbi Yochanan comments on this Beraisa - that one nevertheless needs to annul the Neder in his heart.

11)

(a)The Tana specifically says 'Lo Yomar Adam l'Ishto b'Shabbos Mufar Lechi, Batel Lechi, k'Derech she'Omer Lah b'Chol'. Does this mean that during the week, he is obligated to use this Lashon?

11)

(a)The Tana specifically says 'Lo Yomar Adam l'Ishto b'Shabbos Mufar Lechi, Batel Lechi, k'Derech she'Omer Lah b'Chol' - not because he is obligated to use this Lashon during the week (because Beis Hillel specifically states otherwise, as we shall now see), but because it is the Lashon that one commonly uses.

12)

(a)Beis Shamai in a Beraisa says 'be'Shabbos Mevatel b'Libo, b'Chol Motzi bi'Sefasav'. What do Beis Hillel say?

(b)Does this mean that Beis Shamai permit Hafaras Nedarim which is not verbalized on Shabbos, and Beis Hillel, even during the week?

(c)Some have the text (in the second half of Beis Shamai's statement) 've'la'Erev b'Chol, Motzi bi'Sefasav'. What are Beis Shamai then saying?

(d)On what grounds do we reject this text?

12)

(a)Beis Shamai in a Beraisa says 'be'Shabbos Mevatel b'Libo, b'Chol Motzi bi'Sefasav'. Beis Hillel say 'Echad Zeh v'Echad Zeh, Mevatel b'Libo'.

(b)This does not mean that Beis Shamai permit Hafaras Nedarim which is not verbalized on Shabbos, and Beis Hillel, even during the week - because they both pertain to the previous case, where the husband first said 'Tli v'Ichli, Tli u'Shesi' (and Beis Hillel require both, in similar vein to Rebbi Yochanan).

(c)Some have the text (in the second half of Beis Shamai's statement) 've'la'Erev b'Chol Motzi bi'Sefasav' - in which case, Beis Shamai are saying that after having annulled it in one's heart on Shabbos, he is obligated to annul it verbally on Motza'ei Shabbos.

(d)We reject this text however - on the basis of Beis Hillel, who say 'Echad Zeh v'Echad Zeh, Mevatel b'Libo'. According to this explanation, 'Echad Zeh v'Echad Zeh' is meaningless.

13)

(a)Bearing in mind what we just learned, that 'Ein Ka'n Neder', or 'I Efshi she'Taduri' is not a Lashon Hafarah - how can Beis Hillel permit Bitul b'Lev even in conjunction with 'Tli v'Ichli, Tli u'shsi'?

13)

(a)In spite of what we just learned, that 'Ein Ka'n Neder', or 'I Efshi she'Taduri' is not a Lashon Hafarah - Beis Hillel permit Bitul b'Lev in conjunction with 'Tli v'Ichli, Tli u'Shesi' - because a specific Bitul b'Lev is better than a declaration 'Ein Ka'n Neder' and 'I Efshi she'Taduri', and the fact that the Hafarah is only b'Lev is compensated by adding 'Tli v'Ichli, Tli u'Shesi'.

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