More Discussions for this daf
1. Comparing Kidushin to Gitin 2. Through a Shtar 3. Three ways
4. Tosfos DH Hacha 5. Kesef 6. Kidushin Against A Woman's Wishes
7. Darko Shel Ish la'Chazor 8. Misas ha'Ba'al 9. Kicha Ikrei Kinyan
10. Use of Derech in Masculine and Feminine Terms 11. Kesef as Kidushin 12. Kicha Ikrei Kinyan
13. Tosfos DH I Nami 14. First Tosfos here and in Kesuvos 15. Tosfos DH I Nami
16. Parallels to Yibum and the 3 Methods 17. Who Owns the Ring 18. Kidushin 002: Tosfos DH b'Perutah
19. Derech-Davar 20. Conjunction of multiple acquisitions 21. Kidushin against a woman's will
22. Comparing the term "ha'Ishah Niknis" to "ha'Ish Mekadesh" 23. Get for Yibum 24. Eirusin
25. ha'Isha Niknes 26. Erusin vs. Nisu'in 27. Hiskadshi Li in Rashi
DAF DISCUSSIONS - KIDUSHIN 2

Yosef asked:

hi ive asked 3 qestions eiarliar this week,maybe i wasnt clear enogh or maybe.....

first:from the makashan it doesnt mashma that he suggestshow specificaly the mishna should have been written,rather suggests simply:let it be equal.THIS IS BPASHTUS!

from the gemaras answer:we need to say kesef,which that is kinyan,not kidushin,and like the gemara prooves how its kinyan from a gzeirah shoveh.

the questions are:

1)why did the tartsan understand that the makshan was sugesting anything
specifacly,on the contrary from his words its mashma that he is asking that
generaly it should be equal?

2)and lets assume that the makshan was suggesting a speifcloshon,who says
he was suggesting kidushin?

3)why does the gemara suggest loshon haish to be shoveh everyehere more
than haisha?

4)the order is not understood:first he answers why not kidushin then why
not haish,sounds like first the question was on the loshon of the peulah
(niknes to miskadeshes) and later on the poel (haisha to
hais)(rashi),shouldnt the order of question be the opposite? and of you
will try to say,bemes the question as on both leshonos in the begining,and
then he answered why not kidushin then haish,the question returns,for the
order of the answers are not understood,it should have been the
opposite,like the order of the mishnah!

i hope im clear enogh

please notify me when you riecieve this e-mail,even if you are not going to answer right away thanks thanking you in advance!!!

yosef, ny usa

The Kollel replies:

The Rashba writes that the Makshan could not have asked that the Mishnah should write "ha'Ish Koneh" because then the Mishnah would have to be longer -- "ha'Ish Koneh Es Ishto," whereas "ha'Ishah Niknis" already implies an act of Kidushin.

However, after the Gemara was Machri'a the Lashon of Kinyan because of Sedeh Efron, at this point it is an acceptable question. See the Pnei Yehoshua for the explanation for why it is an acceptable question at this point.

D. Zupnik