THE FIRST STAGE THAT IS CONSIDERED WINE
(Mishnah): It is not considered wine until it descends to the pit.
Contradiction (Mishnah): Wine is Tevel (forbidden to drink until Terumah is taken) after Kipuy (the grape skins float to the top and are removed).
Answer (Rava): Our Mishnah is like Chachamim. The Mishnah about Tevel is like R. Akiva.
(Beraisa #1): Wine is Tevel after it descends to the pit;
R. Akiva says, it is Tevel after Kipuy.
Question: Does R. Akiva refer to Kipuy in the pit, or in the barrel?
Answer (Beraisa #2): Wine is Tevel after Kipuy. Even after Kipuy, one may drink from the upper Gas or pipe without tithing.
Surely, this discusses Kipuy in the pit. (If it were from the barrel, this would not affect the Gas!
Question (Rav Zevid's Beraisa): It is considered wine after it descends to the pit and Kipuy is done;
R. Akiva says, it is after he scoops it into barrels (and does Kipuy).
Answer: This is the meaning of Beraisa #1!
(Chachamim say,) wine is Tevel after it descends to the pit (and Kipuy);
R. Akiva says, it is Tevel after Kipuy (and it was scooped into barrels).
Question: Our Mishnah said that it is not wine until it descends to the pit;
Is there a three-way argument among the Tana'im?!
Answer #1: No. Our Mishnah discusses Yayin Nesech. We are stringent to consider it wine before it really is.
Answer #2: According to Rava (who answered that our Mishnah is like Chachamim, and the Mishnah of Tevel is R. Akiva), we are not more stringent about Yayin Nesech. We must say that there is a three-way argument among the Tana'im.
(Mishnah): What descends to the pit is forbidden. The rest is permitted.
(Rav Huna): This is only if he did not empty out the Gargusni (a bucket with a strainer at the bottom to catch the skins and peels and allow the wine to pass through) back into the Gas. If he did, this forbids the Gas.
Question: What forbids the Gargusni itself?
Answer #1: It is Nitzok (a liquid falling through the air into another liquid, i.e. the wine in the pit).
Inference: Nitzok into Isur forbids the top liquid.
Rejection (and Answer #2): Elsewhere, R. Chiya said that we discuss an overflowing flask. Also here, we can say that the pit was overflowing, it reached up to the bottom of the Gargusni.
DOES A 'NOCHRI' MAKE 'YAYIN NESECH' WHILE STOMPING?
Question: May one stomp grapes with a Nochri?
Answer (A learned six-year old): Yes.
Question: The Nochri will be Menasech the wine! (This forbids benefit from it, so one may not take wages for stomping!)
Answer: The case is, the Nochri's hands are tied.
Question: The Nochri will be Menasech with his foot!
Answer: That is not the normal way to be Menasech. It does not forbid benefit from the wine.
A case occurred in Neharde'a, in which a Nochri and a Yisrael stomped grapes together. Shmuel withheld ruling for three festivals.