MENACHOS 100 - Dedicated by Andy and Nancy Neff in memory of Lucy Rabin, Leah Miriam bat Yisroel. Beloved mother of Nancy Neff, Valerie, Doug and Andy Rabin, and wife of Sidney Rabin, Lucy Rabin passed away on 14 Sivan 5767.






(Mishnah): When Yom Kipur was on Erev Shabbos, at night Bavliyim would eat the Se'ir Chatas raw.


Chulin 14a (Mishnah): If one slaughters on Shabbos, even though he is Chayav Misah, the Shechitah is Kosher.


(Rav): The meat may not be eaten that same day.


(Rabanan): (He holds that) the Mishnah is like R. Yehudah.


93a (R. Aba): Veins in the foreleg are forbidden.


Objection (Rav Safra): Did the Torah forbid all meat?!


Counter-question (Rava): Did the Torah permit blood?! Rather, after cutting them and salting them, the veins may even be cooked in a pot. (No blood remains.)


93b: If raw meat is very red, if it is cut and salted, it may even be cooked in a pot. Alternatively, it suffices to roast it on a spit, for the blood will exude.


If it is over coals, Rav Acha is lenient, and Ravina is stringent.


Rav Acha says that the coals help draw out the blood. Ravina says that they cause the blood to stay inside.


The same applies to Beitzim and veins of the neck.


111a - Rav Zerika: Yehudah brei d'R. Shimon ben Pazi served the branch holding the heart, lungs and liver (cooked together) to me and to Yanai brei d'R. Ami; and we ate it.


(Rav Ashi): (This does not prove that one may cook liver after salting it.) Perhaps the liver had previously been Nichlat (treated so it would not emit blood when cooked)!


Rav Huna would put liver in vinegar (to be Cholet it). Rav Nachman would put boiling water over it.


(Rav Papa): The vinegar becomes forbidden.


Rejection (Rava): If so, also the liver would be forbidden. After it emits, it absorbs!


112a (Shmuel): If one cut meat over bread (and juice fell onto the bread), the bread is forbidden (it absorbed blood).


This is only if the meat was red (i.e. not sufficiently roasted).


113a (Shmuel): If a butcher breaks the neckbone (after Shechitah) before the animal dies, he makes the flesh heavy, steals from the buyer, and causes blood to be absorbed in the limbs.


Question: Is the only problem theft, because he makes blood be absorbed in the limbs? However, people will not eat blood (salting removes the blood);


Or, does he also cause blood be absorbed in the limbs, i.e. and he causes people to eat blood?


This question is unresolved.


(R. Aba): One may not eat the veins in the jaw. If a Kohen does not know to remove them, we do not give to him the jaw.


Rejection: We give to him without concern. If he roasts the jaw, the blood will flow out;


If he cooks it, the blood will come out when he cuts the veins and salts the meat!


Shabbos 128a (Rav Chisda): One may not move unsalted meat.


Question: Rav Chisda commanded to move a (slaughtered) goose from the sun to the shade, lest it spoil!


Answer: An unsalted goose is different, for it is proper to eat it raw.


Kerisus 21b (Rav Sheshes): There is no Mitzvah to refrain from eating human blood, not even a mere stringency.


Question (Beraisa): A Lav forbids blood of the spleen, heart, kidneys, and limbs;


Blood of people, Sheratzim and Remashim is forbidden, but one is not liable for them.


Answer: The Beraisa forbids it when it separated. Rav Sheshes permits it when it did not separate;


(Beraisa): If blood is on a loaf, one scrapes it off and the loaf is permitted;


One may swallow blood between one's teeth without concern.




Rif (Chulin 42b): Since the question (about one who broke the neckbone) was not resolved, we are stringent about Safek Isur.


Ran (30b DH Chatchei): The Ri derived that since the Gemara says 'if he cut (the veins) and salted, we permit even in a pot. This implies that until now we were discussing roasting, and even so, veins of the foreleg are forbidden. This is wrong. We say just like this about veins of the neck. If he cut and salted them, they are permitted even in a pot. The Gemara connotes that nothing is needed for roasting, since we say that it suffices to roast on a spit, for the blood will exude. Do not say that this is after cutting it. The Gemara said Stam that the blood will exude! Also, if they were cut, why is one opinion stringent if they are on coals? Surely the blood flows out! Rather, we discuss without cutting. We need not cut veins for roasting. Also 133a connotes like this. If one roasts the jaw, the blood in the veins will flow out. If he cooks it, the blood will come out when (beforehand) he cuts the veins and salts the meat! It mentions cutting and salting only for cooking. This implies that meat with veins is like regular meat regarding roasting.


Rambam (Hilchos Ma'achalos Asuros 6:9): If one broke the neckbone of an animal before it died, the blood is absorbed in the limbs. One may not eat it raw, even through Chalitah. Rather, he cuts the piece and salts it very well, and then cooks or roasts it.


Magid Mishneh: Some Meforshim learn from here (one who broke the neckbone) that blood of limbs that never separated is permitted. We forbid only because he broke the neckbone before it died. If not, one could eat the meat raw. They brought proofs for this. It is primary. The Rambam disagrees. He holds that all raw meat is forbidden mid'Rabanan without Chalitah or salting. If he broke the neckbone, it is forbidden even through Chalitah. The Rashba holds like the first opinion. One must remove veins with blood, for it is as if the blood inside separated.


Rambam (12): If one wants to eat raw meat, he salts and rinses it well. If he did Chalitah in vinegar, he may eat it raw.


Rebuttal (Ra'avad): One need not salt meat to eat it raw. Blood of the limbs that did not separate is permitted. Also Rav Achai says so.


Rosh (Chulin 1:19): The Gemara connotes that only R. Yehudah forbids the meat the same day, but R. Meir permits, even though one cannot salt it. Blood of limbs is forbidden, but only if it separated. One may eat raw meat. Chachamim ate liver after Chalitah. Vinegar causes that the blood does not exude in cooking. The vinegar is permitted. If it would absorb blood, also the liver would be forbidden, for after the liver emits, it absorbs! If one cut meat over bread, the bread is forbidden, but the meat is permitted! This refers to meat that was not fully roasted (there is still blood inside). If one slaughtered for a sick person on Shabbos, healthy people may eat from it raw (Chulin 15b). An unsalted goose is not Muktzah, for it is proper to eat it raw. We do not forbid because blood went from one side of the meat to the other. This is not considered like blood that separated. This is even if it was not totally roasted, and not all the blood left afterwards. What leaves, the fire absorbs. What remains is blood of limbs that never separated. Going from side to side is not considered separating. We learn from meat cut over bread. Therefore, one need not salt meat before roasting it.


Drishah (YD 76:1): This is unlike blood that gathered in a piece, or left its place and was aroused to leave and was absorbed elsewhere, which is forbidden. There, it was aroused to leave in the animal's lifetime, so it is blood that separated. Here, the fire aroused it to leave (after death). Therefore, we say that whatever the fire aroused to leave, it totally left and fell into the fire.


Question (Shach 76:2): This is astounding. The Rosh says that even what remains inside, it is as if it did not separate. One can answer simply that it is not considered blood that separated, because it did not separate during its life. Perhaps there is a printing mistake in the Drishah.


Tosfos Yom Tov (Menachos 11:7 DH Ochlin): They may eat the Chatas of Yom Kipur raw, even though it was not salted, because in Kerisus (21b) we forbid blood of limbs only if it separated.


Rebuttal (Rishon l'Tziyon Menachos 11:7): Also the Beis Yosef cites this from Kerisus. The Gemara there does not distinguish (regarding blood of animals)! Tosfos (and the Rosh) brought proofs from elsewhere. Perhaps the Beis Yosef means that Tosfos established Kerisus 21b to obligate for blood that separated.


Tosfos (Chulin 14a DH v'Nisvin): The Gemara connotes that Chachamim permit the meat the same day, even though one cannot salt it. We can say that they permit the meat if one transgressed and salted it. Alternatively, it is permitted raw without salting it.


Teshuvas ha'Rosh (2:17): If blood separated from place to place within the meat, but did not leave, it is permitted, like blood of limbs that did not separate. R. Shimshon said similarly (Tosfos 14a).


Teshuvas ha'Rashba (1:466, to the Rosh): I am stringent about this, for the Gemara did not resolve this (113a).




Shulchan Aruch (YD 67:1): A Lav forbids blood absorbed in limbs, if it left the limb, or gathered in a piece, or left its place and was aroused to leave and was absorbed elsewhere. If it did not separate or gather, it is permitted.


Gilyon Maharsha: We are concerned for blood of limbs only if it separated in the animal's lifetime, like the Shach said.


Shulchan Aruch (2): Therefore, one may eat raw meat after rinsing it, without salting it, as long as it does not have veins with blood. Blood in veins is as if it is gathered in a Kli.


Shach (1): One must rinse it due to the blood on the surface.


Beis Yosef (DH v'Kivan): Mahari ben Chaviv said that the Rambam seems to contradict himself. He permits raw meat through Chalitah. This implies that blood of limbs that did not separate is permitted. He concluded that the Rambam permits. Even so, he requires salting raw meat, lest when one cuts it, a little blood start to separate from the limbs. However, he need not leave it in salt for a long time, like for meat that one will cook. Rather, one salts Arai (lightly), the way we salt before roasting. However, to eat raw meat one must rinse it well, but for roasting one need not rinse it, for the fire absorbs the blood.


Rebuttal (Beis Yosef ibid.): The Rambam says that he must salt it well. This connotes like we salt for cooking! To resolve the Rambam, I say that he forbids blood of limbs that did not separate if it could separate. After Chalitah, it cannot separate, so it is permitted.


Gra (4): Chulin 93b proves that blood in veins is forbidden.