KIDUSHIN 58 - Dedicated by a Talmid of Rabbi Kornfeld in Chicago. May Hashem bestow upon him and his wife Berachah in all their endeavors, and Yiddishe Nachas and joy from their dear children.

1)

(a)Rebbi Shimon in a Beraisa validates Kidushin that were performed with Petter Chamor, Basar b'Chalav and Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'zarah. What do the Chachamim say?

(b)What is Rebbi Shimon's reason in the case of ...

1. ... Petter Chamor (during its lifetime) and Basar b'Chalav?

2. ... Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah?

(c)What is the reason for the latter decree?

1)

(a)Rebbi Shimon in a Beraisa validates Kidushin that were performed with Petter Chamor, Basar b'Chalav and Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah. The Chachamim render it invalid.

(b)Rebbi Shimon's reason in the case of ...

1. ... Petter Chamor and Basar b'Chalav is because he holds that both are only Asur b'Hana'ah mid'Rabanan, as we learned above (see Mesores ha'Shas on the previous Amud)

2. ... Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah is because he disagrees with the various Derashos that we just cited to prove that it is d'Oraisa. According to him, the Isur is only mid'Rabanan.

(c)The reason for the latter decree is in case people (believing the Chulin to be Kodshim), will take their cue from there and permit deriving benefit from Kodshim before the blood has been sprinkled.

2)

(a)Mar Yehudah had a problem with the above ruling of Rebbi Shimon from another statement of his. What did Rebbi Shimon say in another Beraisa regarding a Beheimah of Chulin or a Chayah that were Shechted in the Azarah?

(b)Why does Mar Yehudah have ...

1. ... no problem with the case of Beheimah?

2. ... a problem with the case of Chayah?

(c)Why would he have no problem if Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah were d'Oraisa?

2)

(a)Mar Yehudah had a problem with the above ruling of Rebbi Shimon from another statement of Rebbi Shimon, who said in a Beraisa that a Beheimah of Chulin or a Chayah that were Shechted in the Azarah must be burned.

(b)Mar Yehudah has ...

1. ... no problem with the case of Beheimah because, since they are of the same species as Kodshim, it is understandable for the Chachamim to decree a Chulin animal on account of one of Kodshim (so that people should not think that Kodshim that became Pasul must be buried, as Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah ought to be).

2. ... a problem with the case of a Chayah because, since one cannot possibly confuse it with a Beheimah, added to the fact that the Isur by Chayah is purely mid'Rabanan, there is no reason as to why it should be burned and not simply buried.

(c)If Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah were d'Oraisa, he would have no problem because since the Isur to slaughter in the Azarah would be d'Oraisa, it would be feasible for the Chachamim to give a Chayah the same Din as a Beheimah, so as not to differentiate between them (Lo P'lug).

3)

(a)Rabah was not impressed with Mar Yehudah's Kashya. What title did he confer upon him?

(b)How does Rabah establish the first ruling of Rebbi Shimon, validating a Kidushin performed with Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah?

(c)How does this answer Mar Yehudah's Kashya?

(d)What status does Rabah ascribe to a regular animal of Chulin that is Shechted in the Azarah, according to Rebbi Shimon?

3)

(a)Rabah was not impressed with Mar Yehudah's Kashya. The title that he conferred upon him was that of 'Palga' (meaning argumentative), because he was accustomed to quarrel with the Rabanan (more for the sake of differing with their opinion, it seems, than in order to search for the truth).

(b)Rabah establishes the first ruling of Rebbi Shimon, validating a Kidushin performed with Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah when the animal was found to be a Tereifah, and Rebbi Shimon follows his ruling elsewhere, that a Shechitah which does not permit the animal to be eaten, is not considered a Shechitah.

(c)That being the case the Chulin animal that was 'Shechted' in the Azarah does not fall under the category of Chulin she'Nishchatu ba'Azarah at all, and is therefore Mutar b'Hana'ah.

(d)According to Rebbi Shimon, Rabah considers a regular animal of Chulin that is Shechted in the Azarah Asur d'Oraisa.

4)

(a)What do we learn from the Pasuk in Ekev "Vehayisa Cherem Kamohu"?

(b)What can we extrapolate from there with regard to other Isurei Hana'ah?

(c)Why do we not learn from a 'Mah Matzinu' from Avodas Kochavim, that the Isur is transferred to the money?

(d)What do we learn from ...

1. ... the Pasuk in Behar "Yovel Hi, Kodesh Tiheyeh Lachem"?

2. ... the word "Tiheyeh"? What would we otherwise have thought?

4)

(a)We learn from the Pasuk in Ekev "Vehayisa Cheirem Kamohu" that the Isur Hana'ah of Avodas-Kochavim is transferred to the money that one pays for it.

(b)We can extrapolate from there that if one sells other Isurei Hana'ah the Isur is not transferred to the money, (which explains the Seifa of our Mishnah 'Machrah v'Kidesh bi'Demeihen, Mekudeshes).

(c)We cannot learn from a 'Mah Matzinu' from Avodas Kochavim, that the Isur is transferred on to the money because the same applies to Shevi'is fruit, in which case we have two Pesukim teaching us the same thing, and we will apply the principle 'Shnei Kesuvim ha'Ba'im k'Echad', and we rule 'Ein Melamdin'.

(d)We learn from ...

1. ... the Pasuk in b'har "Yovel Hi Kodesh Tiheyeh Lachem" that the Isur of Shevi'is fruit, like that of Avodas Kochavim, is transferred to the money.

2. ... the word "Tiheyeh" that the actual fruit remains forbidden (in which case, it would be more correct to say that it extends [rather than is transferred], to the money).

5)

(a)What actually happens with the proceeds of Shevi'is in a case where one purchases ...

1. ... meat with Shemitah fruit?

2. ... fish with the meat, wine with the fish, and oil with the wine?

(b)According to those who hold 'Shnei Kesuvim ha'Ba'im k'Echad Melamdin', what do we learn from the Pasuk "Ki Cherem Hu" and the Pasuk "Yovel Hi"?

5)

(a)If one purchases ...

1. ... meat with Shemitah fruit both have Kedushas Shevi'is.

2. ... fish with the meat, wine with the fish, and oil with the wine then the fruit and the oil have Kedushas Shevi'is, but not the fish, the meat and the wine.

(b)According to those who hold 'Shnei Kesuvim ha'Ba'im k'Echad Melamdin', we learn from the Pasuk "Ki Cherem Hu" and the Pasuk "Yovel Hi" (by way of a 'Miy'ut') that only by Yovel and Shevi'is does the Isur transfer to the money, but not by other Isurei Hana'ah (though it is unclear why one 'Miy'ut' will not suffice).

6)

(a)What does our Mishnah say about someone who betroths a woman with Terumos, Ma'asros, Matanos, Mei Chatas and Eifer Parah?

(b)The Tana adds 'va'Afilu Yisrael'. According to the plain meaning of the words, with what is he betrothing her?

(c)What principle can we extrapolate from the Mishnah, according to this interpretation?

(d)Rebbi Aba therefore queries a statement of Ula from this Mishnah. What did Ula say?

6)

(a)Our Mishnah rules that if someone betroths a woman with Terumos, Ma'asros, Matanos, Mei Chatas and Eifer Parah the Kidushin is valid.

(b)The Tana adds 'va'Afilu Yisrael'. According to the plain meaning of the words, this means that the Mekadesh is betrothing the woman with the 'Tovas Hana'ah' (the right to give it to whichever Kohen or Levi ... he wishes, and that is what he now transfers to her).

(c)According to this interpretation, we can extrapolate from the Mishnah the principle 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon' (a right is considered value).

(d)Rebbi Aba therefore queries a statement of Ula, who ruled 'Tovas Hana'ah Einah Mamon'.

7)

(a)How does Ula establish our Mishnah to answer the Kashya?

(b)What Chidush is the Tana then coming to teach us?

(c)Why did Ula not establish the Mishnah when the Mekadesh inherited Terumah from his maternal grandfather?

(d)When Rav Huna attempted to resolve Rav Chiya bar Avin's She'eilah as to whether Tovas Hana'ah is Mamon or not, from our Mishnah, the latter pointed to Ula's interpretation of the Mishnah. What did ...

1. ... Rav Huna mean when he retorted "Hotza'ah At'?

2. ... Rav Chiya bar Avin think Rav Huna meant (with the result that h felt embarrassed)?

7)

(a)To answer the Kashya, Ula establishes our Mishnah when the Mekadesh inherited Tevel from his maternal grandfather (who was a Kohen, even though he is a Yisrael), and that is what he betroths the woman with.

(b)And the Chidush then is that 'Matanos she'Lo Hurmu k'Mi she'Hurmu Damyan' (i.e. although the Tevel contained the undesignated Terumos, they are considered as if they had been designated, in which case the original owner acquired them, and all they now require is designation and separation.

(c)Ula did not establish the Mishnah when the Mekadesh inherited Terumah from his maternal grandfather because then there would be no Chidush.

(d)When Rav Huna attempted to resolve Rav Chiya bar Avin's She'eilah as to whether Tovas Hana'ah is Mamon or not, from our Mishnah, the latter pointed to Ula's interpretation of the Mishnah. When Rav Huna retorted ...

1. ... "Hotza'ah At' he meant that Rav Asi from Hutzal conformed with his opinion. However ...

2. ... Rav Chiya bar Avin understood Rav Huna's remark derogatorily (with the result that he felt embarrassed). He thought he meant that he was removed from the Sugya (i.e. that he did not understand it properly), or that he 'cuts canes in the marsh' (an expression implying that one is insignificant [from the word 'Hutza' meaning a weak fence]).

58b----------------------------------------58b

8)

(a)According to Rebbi in a Beraisa, someone who steals his friend's Tevel and eats it, is obligated to pay for everything he ate. Considering that part of what he ate is Chulin, and part Ma'asros, what exactly does this mean?

(b)What does Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah say?

(c)We refute the suggestion that Rebbi holds 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon', whereas Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah holds 'Tovas Hana'ah Eino Mamon'. What then, is the basis of their Machlokes? What is the case?

(d)What do both opinions then hold with regard to 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon?

8)

(a)According to Rebbi in a Beraisa, someone who steals his friend's Tevel and eats it, is obligated to pay for everything he ate for the Chulin in full and for the Ma'asros according to the Tovas Hana'ah that his friend had in them.

(b)Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah says that he only needs to pay for the Chulin that he ate, but not for the Ma'asros.

(c)We refute the suggestion that Rebbi holds 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon', whereas Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah holds 'Tovas Hana'ah Eino Mamon', establishing the basis of their Machlokes as whether 'Matanos she'Lo Hurmu k'Hurmu Damyan' (Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah), or not (Rebbi, in which case all the Ma'asros are considered like Chulin), and the Tana speaks when the owner had inherited Tevel from his maternal grandfather, as we explained earlier. Note, that the grandfather Kohen acquired Ma'aser Rishon, too, based on the penalty of Ezra, stripping the Leviyim of their rights to claim it.

(d)And both opinions hold 'Tovas Hana'ah Eino Mamon' (like Ula).

9)

(a)Alternatively, both Tana'im hold ' ... K'mi she'Hurmu Damyan' and 'Tovas Hana'ah Eino Mamon', and they argue over Shmuel's Din. What does Shmuel say regarding Shi'ur Terumah?

(b)What is then their Machlokes?

(c)What will Rebbi say regarding Ma'asros?

(d)We could have established their Machlokes like in the previous case (when the owner inherited the Tevel from his maternal grandfather Kohen; in which case both Tana'im would hold ' ... K'mi she'Lo Hurmu Damyan' and 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon', and they argue over Shmuel's Din. Why did we not do so?

9)

(a)Alternatively, both Tana'im hold ' ...K'mi she'Hurmu Damyan' and 'Tovas Hana'ah Eino Mamon' and the Beraisa is speaking about crops that grew in the owner's field, and they argue over Shmuel, who says that 'One kernel exempts the pile' (i.e. min ha'Torah, one is not obligated to separate no more than one grain for Terumah).

(b)Rebbi holds like Shmuel. Consequently the owner can claim the full value of his stolen Tevel (minus one grain); whereas, Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah does not. Consequently, the thief is only obligated to pay for the Chulin, but not for the Terumah.

(c)Rebbi only argues with Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah regarding Terumah but not regarding Ma'asros (which the owner would have had to give to the Levi (or to the Kohen, as we explained earlier) in full.

(d)We could have established their Machlokes like in the previous case (when the owner inherited the Tevel from his maternal grandfather Kohen; in which case both Tana'im would hold ' ... K'mi she'Lo Hurmu Damyan' and 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon, and they argue over Shmuel's Din, We did not so however, because it would mean that the Tana of our Mishnah (who holds 'Mekudeshes', either because 'Tovas Hana'ah Mamon' or because ' Matanos ... K'mi she'Hurmu Damyan') will hold like neither of the two.

10)

(a)Finally, we propose that neither Tana holds like Shmuel, or that both hold like him. Assuming that Rebbi does not hold like Shmuel, why might he nevertheless obligate the thief to pay in full?

(b)And why might Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah exempt him from paying in full, even if he does hold like Shmuel?

10)

(a)Finally, we propose that neither Tana holds like Shmuel, or that both hold like him. Even if Rebbi does not hold like Shmuel, he might nevertheless obligate the thief to pay in full as a penalty for stealing (because otherwise the money, which has no claimants, will simply remain unclaimed).

(b)And Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Yehudah might exempt him from paying in full, even if he does because he penalizes the owner for leaving his crops un'Ma'asered.

11)

(a)What does the Mishnah in Bechoros say about ...

1. ... a Dayan who takes money to judge?

2. ... witnesses who take money to testify?

3. ... a Kohen who takes money to sprinkle?

4. ... a Kohen who takes money to mix the Mei Parah?

(b)How do we resolve our Mishnah, which rules 'ha'Mekadesh ... b'Mei Chatas u've'Eifer Parah, Mekudeshes, va'Afilu Yisrael', with the Mishnah in Bechoros? What sort of Hana'ah is the man (and subsequently the woman permitted to derive from the Mei Chatas and the Eifer Parah)?

(c)How do we substantiate this answer from the difference in wording between the two Mishnayos?

11)

(a)The Mishnah in Bechoros rules that ...

1. ... if a Dayan takes money to judge his judgments are invalid.

2. ... if witnesses take money to testify their testimony is invalid.

3. ... if a Kohen takes money to sprinkle the ashes of the Parah Adumah the ashes are considered like ashes from an oven.

4. ... if a Kohen takes money to mix the Mei Parah the water is like water from a cave.

(b)We resolve our Mishnah which rules 'ha'Mekadesh ... b'Mei Chatas u've'Eifer Parah, Mekudeshes, va'Afilu Yisrael', with the Mishnah in Bechoros by establishing it with regard to taking money for transporting the ashes or for filling the water (which is permitted).

(c)And we substantiate this answer from the fact that our Mishnah says 'be'Mei Chatas u've'Eifer Parah' whereas the Mishnah in Bechoros says 'Lehazos u'Lekadesh'.

Hadran Alach 'ha'Ish Mekadesh'

Perek ha'Omer

12)

(a)What will be the Din if someone asks his friend to betroth a woman on his behalf and he betroths her himself? To whom is she betrothed?

(b)To which man will a woman be betrothed if a man betroths a woman whom another man betrothed earlier ...

1. ... for after thirty days?

2. ... from then and after thirty days?

(c)Assuming that a second man did not betroth her, then in the Reisha, she is permitted to eat Terumah during those thirty days (see Tosfos Yom Tov). Why, in the Seifa, is she not, assuming she is ...

1. ... a bas Yisrael l'Kohen?

2. ... a bas Kohen l'Yisrael?

12)

(a)If someone asks his friend to betroth a woman on his behalf and he betroths her himself his Kidushin is valid.

(b)If a man betroths a woman whom another man betrothed earlier ...

1. ... for after thirty days she will be betrothed to the second man.

2. ... from then and after thirty days she is Safek Mekudeshes to both.

(c)Assuming that a second man did not betroth her, then in the Reisha, she is permitted to eat Terumah during those thirty days (see Tosfos Yom Tov). In the Seifa, she is not, assuming she is ...

1. ... a bas Yisrael l'Kohen because the Kidushin may not be valid.

2. ... a bas Kohen l'Yisrael in case it is.

13)

(a)What does the Beraisa comment about the case in the Reisha of our Mishnah, where the man betrothed the woman whom his friend had asked him to betroth on his behalf?

(b)How do infer this from the Lashon of the Mishnah 'ha'Omer la'Chaveiro ... v'Halach v'Kidshah l'Atzmo ... '?

13)

(a)In the case in the Reisha of our Mishnah, where the man betrothed the woman whom his friend had asked him to betroth on his behalf the Beraisa comments that, even though the Kidushin is valid, he is nevertheless considered to be a trickster.

(b)We infer this from the Tana's insertion of the word ' 've'Halach' (i.e. 've'Halach v'Kidshah l'Atzmo ... ').

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