More Discussions for this daf
1. Shelamim and Rav Papa 2. Tul Chelkecha v'Tzei 3. Ein Maftirin by Pesach Sheni
DAF DISCUSSIONS - PESACHIM 89

Daniel Gray asks:

Rashi explains the korban Olah cannot be sold since it's for Kaparas Ba'alim. Why can the Shelamim not be sold?

R Papa conceded that Paleg applies, Ravina too must so concede if that is Halachah v'Lo Rak Lifnim mi'Shuras ha'Din O mi'Safek, if so why the exasperation over him being a bigger eater than R Papa if anyway Paleg can be insisted upon?

Daniel Gray, Toronto

The Kollel replies:

1) The Gemara below 90a states that the din that Shelamim cannot be sold, cannot be applicable according to Rabbi Yosi Hagalili who maintains that kodashim kalim belong to the owners. According to this it is only according to Rabanan; who maintain that kodashim kalim are Mamon Gavohah and belong to the Beis Hamikdash and therefore cannot be sold; that this includes that shelamim cannot be sold.

2) However, there is a problem with the way the Rambam learns this sugya. In Hilchos Meilah 4:8 he rules according to the Beraisa on 89b that someone who tries to sell his Olah and Shelamim has achieved nothing. We saw that this seemingly cannot follow R. Yosi Hagalili. The Mishneh LeMelech points out that this contradicts what the Rambam writes in Hilchos Nizkei Mamon 8:1 that for kodashim for which Meilah applies the din of damages does not apply. This implies that for kodashim for which Meilah does not apply, damages do apply. In other words, for kodashim kalim there is liability for damage caused. This is specifically the opinion of R. Yosi Hagalili in Bava Kama 13b that kodashim kalim belong to their hedyot owners and therefore one is liable for damaging them. Mishnah LeMelech writes that the Rambam "has granted the document of sale to both buyers"; he has contradicted himself because sometimes he paskens like R. Yosi and sometimes he paskens against him.

3) Tzalach here, top 90a, answers that even according to R. Yosi; whilst Shelamim is Mamon Baalim, this does not mean that the owners are such absolute owners that if they sell it to someone else this will be considered his korban which Hash-m will be pleased with. The original owners cannot sell the atonement from the korban (see Ketzos HaChoshen 406:1 DH Omnam).

Purim Sameach

Dovid Bloom

Follow-up reply:

By the time they realized he was such a big eater he had already eaten up a lot of their food!

Dovdi Bloom