More Discussions for this daf
1. Removing Ochel from Pesoles 2. Tosfos Abbreviation מ"ר 3. Muktzah l'Tzorech Ochel Nefesh
4. Cleaning leather 5. Removing Muktzah to get at the food 6. Throwing out the stone
7. Carrying a purse on Shabbos 8. Shaking rock for basket -- why is it not Borer? 9. Basis l'Davar ha'Asur
DAF DISCUSSIONS - SHABBOS 142

Jeff Ram asked:

Our gemara wants to compare the muktza pebbles mixed into beans on Yom Tov with the muktza stone on top of the barrel on Shabbos. Stated another way, the Gemara is saying that tiltul? muktza L'tzorich ochel nefesh on Yom Tov (picking pebbles out of the beans) is mutar, and? this compares to tiltul muktza L'tzorich ochel nefesh on Shabbos!! *BUT* we know that tiltul muktza L'tzorich ochel nefesh is *asur* on Shabbos! I don't understand how can the Gemara try make this comparison in the first place? Nor could we sort it out in shi'ur today. Can you help us?

warm regards,

Jeff Ram,

Jerusalem

The Kollel replies:

The key to understanding your question is based on the RASHBA here and is clarified by the CHAZON ISH (46:15).

First of all, it is not clear that "l'Tzorech Ochel Nefesh" applies at all on Shabbos. Doing a Melachah, or handling Muktzah for the sake of food preparation is no different than doing Melachah or handling Muktzah for any other purpose.

However, there is a concept on Shabbos called "Tikun Ochlin." One is permitted to prepare food for eating on Shabbos, even if it comes inside of a shell, which is normally Muktzah (since it cannot be used for anything). The Rabanan permitted handling Muktzah in order to make a food edible. In the case at hand, the stone is like the shell of a nut -- it is keeping the food (the wine in the barrel) from being edible, and therefore the stone *may be handled*.

The Gemara's question, then, is that when there is a choice to either handle the Muktzah directly or to move the Heter (the barrel), is it still permitted to directly handle the Muktzah, or must we handle only the Heter?

To answer this question, the Gemara cites a Halachah from Yom Tov, from which we see clearly that when there is a choice between Heter (Ochel) and being Tore'ach with Isur (Pesoles) where the Isur of Muktzah is relaxed (again because of Tikun Ochel, and because there is no Borer on Yom Tov according to Beis Hillel), even Beis Hillel agrees that we should move the Ochel and not the Pesoles. The Gemara learns, therefore, from the laws of Yom Tov that when it is permitted to move Muktzah (because of Tikun Ochel) and one can accomplish the same thing by moving Heter, one should move the Heter and not the Isur.

This seems to be the answer to your question.

All the best,

Y. Shaw