More Discussions for this daf
1. Two Lameds 2. "Ish Ish" 3. Na'arah and Bogeres
4. Cursing a Father 5. Cursing a Leader
 DAF DISCUSSIONS - SANHEDRIN 66
1. H. David Levine asks:

Would the scriptural prohibition against cursing a judge or leader apply to an elected representative, who is more properly considered a servant of the people?

H. David Levine, Roanoke, VA; USA

2. The Kollel replies:

An elected representative has the same status as a king, since even the original kings were elected both by the nation and by a prophet. (See Shmuel I 8-11.) Since we lack prophecy today the authority to appoint elected representatives reverts back to the people and therefore an elected representative is like a king (Teshuvos Mishpat Kohen 144).

A king cannot be cursed, and, even in private, Koheles warns against cursing a king since he may hear of this and punish the person who cursed him (Bava Basra 4a). However, if the king or elected leader does not act in accordance with the Torah and there is no possibility of retribution, one is allowed to curse him (Sanhedrin 85a, Makos 8a, Hagahos Maimoni, Sanhedrin, chap. 26). However, the Rambam, Tur, and Shulchan Aruch do not mention this caveat, and it is unclear whether they prohibit even cursing a leader who does not act in accordance with the Torah.

Yoel Domb

3. David Quinn asks:

Hi,

Your answer above includes a part I am having trouble accepting in the context of modern first-world governments: Since we lack prophecy today the authority to appoint elected representatives reverts back to the people and therefore an elected representative is like a king (Teshuvos Mishpat Kohen 144).

I don't read Hebrew, and online automatic Hebrew translators (terrible anyway) would not help because I don't see this text online. Therefore I have not found a way to read it for myself.

A mayor, governor or president is our modern version of a king. But a representative (legislator) doesn't act in a king-like way. A congresswoman cannot make any ruling by herself -- thank God. They only speak as a group. The legislature makes laws, a function once performed by rabbis with their halachic pronouncements and prophets bringing down messages from God. It's hard to think of legislators as rabbis either, because some are learned but some are not. Rabbis were never popularly elected representatives. So I think legislators are a sort of new category, but they aren't kings and queens.

David Quinn

4. The Kollel replies:

The authority of the executive arm of government stems in a democracy from its acceptance by the nation. The legislators, who are elected by the nation, are the ones who give authority to the executive arm. It is true that they do not have the same authority themselves but they do elect and depose governments. Therefore, they do have a measure of power which the Sanhedrin, for example, did not have and should therefore be considered like a "king" even though their power is marginal. Each legislator is important, sometimes one of them is enough to depose or elect a government. (Witness the second election we are experiencing in Israel because of a lack of one more vote in favor of the government.)

Yoel Domb