Shalom u'Verachah!
It's well-known that YID'ONI involves a bone; but I saw in the "Background to the Daf" (https://dafyomi.co.il/sanhedrin/backgrnd/sn-in-053.htm#6) that "Ov" also involves a bone! ("To get it to speak, the diviner would put a certain bone in his armpit and flap his arms or move around in various ways.") Would you please send me a source for this? I couldn't find this in the meforshim where I looked. i>I would have thought that it's a mistake, BUT, I also heard someone say this in a shiur as well!
Also -- If someone does the Aveirah of Ov or Yid'oni, will he also be Chayav a separate Aveirah of Kishuf, or is Ov/Yid'oni part of Kishuf?
THANKS SO MUCH and kol tuv!
Yosef Dovid Rosenberg
Hi Yosef Dovid,
The Rambam (Avoda Zara 6,1) says that as a rule, Ov is getting a dead spirit to speak. One of the ways to do so is to actually use the dead skull and get to speak somehow through the armpit of the living person.
As for the second question, we need to separate between the question whether Ov and Yidoni are a sort of Kishuf, and the answer is, that they are of course, and that is why they are brought down together in the same Posuk, and another question, how many Malkos does a person who does this sort of Kishuf get. The second question is a more difficult question which has to do with the opinions in the Sugya of Las she'ba'Klalos, a sort of Lavim that are brought together in one Posuk, but are still differentiated one from each other in some way. The Rambam elaborates about this in Sefer ha'Mitzvos (Shoresh 9).
Best Regards,
Aharon Steiner