More Discussions for this daf
1. Pesharah 2. Rabbi Meir and Brouria 3. Midrash does not contradict Gemara
4. Davening in a lower spot and the evening Shema 5. Elisha 6. Elisha and the Shunamis
7. Zman Krias Shema 8. Holiness and Flies 9. Davening For Others
10. Going on one's own merit 11. Semuchin, Shirah in the womb 12. Elisha was Kadosh
13. 14. Chizkiyahu's misdeeds 15. Gog u'Magog
16. Ibur HaChodesh and Melech Chizkiyahu 17. She'lo Yistakel be'Makom Ervah
DAF DISCUSSIONS - BERACHOS 10

David Goldman asked:

Shalom! I couldn't help wondering about the gemara that says that the Shunamit said Elisha was kadosh. My question:

(a) For the man d'amar who says that no fly approached his table, this would be
a sign that he was certainly a tzadik, someone on a higher level than the
average erliche Yid.

BUT for the other man d'amar who said she set a sheet of linen and saw no KERI, how is this particularly a sign that he was on such a high madrega? Not having a fly at he table is certainly a sign of a much higher madrega than not seeing keri, since even "relatively lowly Jews (in those days)are not likely to see keri. So why would the absence of keri mean he was a kadosh? These examples don't seem to be comparable...

(b) Furthermore, was she in the habit of inspecting men's sheets who were
staying overnight without their wives?? Why was this such a significant
criteria for her?

(c) Also, what does the gemara mean to say Gehazi HELD hod yafeha, EVEN by
accident? This would (lechoyra) seem absurd as a criteria for determining
the kedusha of Elisha compared to Gehazi. How could a Tzaddik - a navi -
have a servant who would do such a thing (HOLD) in the first place, even by
accident? Holding is much different than merely touching by accident.

What is the gemara saying?

Thanks.

The Kollel replies:

(a) We find in the Gemara that traveling causes nocturnal emission. Since Elisha always lodged at the home of the Shunamis after traveling and yet never did he have such an emission, it was a clear sign that he was a man of great Kedushah who guarded his thoughts from any impurity.

(b) She was the one who changed the linen for the guest.

(c) RABEINU NISIM GAON (on the side of the Gemara) has the text, "He pushed her by her Hod Yafeha," and not that he actually grabbed her there. This also seems to be the correct reading based on the word "l'Hadfah" in the verse, which means to push.