More Discussions for this daf
1. Simcha offerings 2. Beis Hillel and Beis Shammai - Deeper meaning? 3. Klaloseihen
4. Klalos Nemra Bsinai 5. Beis Shamai vs. Beis Hillel on Olas Re'iyah and Shalmei Chagigah 6. Korban Chagigah in partnership etc.
7. Korban Olah before Matan Torah 8. Comment on Outlines 9. Kelalim
10. Klalim u'Pratim b'Matan Torah 11. Why is the gemoro only discussing chigger in bes shamai 12. הזבחים ומנחה הגשתם לי
DAF DISCUSSIONS - CHAGIGAH 6

Norman Zabrowsky asked:

(a) What is the exact obligation on each bar chiyuva?

Does each male who is bar mitzva have bring his own korbon shlomom as a chagigah?

(b) Can he be a partner with other people?

Can he be a member of a family group who eats the Chagigah that the head of the family brings?

(c) Can he send the Chagigah via a shleeach even if he himself does not eat the Chagigah?

Norman Zabrowsky, Clark, NJ USA

The Kollel replies:

(a) The Gemara implies that every male that is obligated in Mitzvos is also obligated to bring a Chagigah, similar to Olas Re'iyah which everyone brings when he is "Olah l'Regel". The Beraisa equates the two (6b): "Bnei Yisroel are obligated in three Mitzvos on a Regel: Re'iyah, Chagigah, and Simchah."

(b) In connection to partnership, I did not find an allusion in the Gemara that one could bring it with a partner, nor does the Rambam discuss it. The Minchas Chinuch (Mitzva 81) infers from Rashi (Pesachim 89a "b'Memaneh Acherim Imo...") that the Chagigah of Yom Tov cannot be brought with a partner. Others point out that his proof is far from conclusive.

But the Turei Even (on 6a "Ha'raya") writes, based on logical proofs alone, that the Re'iyah and the Chagigah can both be brought in partnership (since it is highly unlikely for an entire animal to cost but two Kesef). The Halachah is actually discussed openly in the Tosefta (1:7), which states clearly that if a one does not have enough money to bring a Korbon Re'iyah or Chagigah on his own he may bring it in partnership with someone else, as long as the minimum of two Kesef is paid by each.

This lends insight to the wording of the Mishnah on 6b: "He who has many eaters and only a minimum of possessions brings an abundance of Shelamim". Rashi says there that the Mishnah is referring to Shalmei Chagigah (see the Turei Even there, who proves Rashi's contention from the Sugya).

How could someone have an abundance of eaters (for his Chagigah), if each person must bring his very own Chagigah? (It is somewhat forced to say that the Mishnah is only referring to eaters such as women and children who do not bring their own Korban.) According to the Tosefta it is quite understandable. The Mishnah means to say that if one had many children (who had reached puberty) and brothers, and they cannot afford to each bring their own Chagigah, they should join him and become partners in his Chagigah. Thus the words of the Tosefta are alluded to in the Mishnah.

(c) It seems from the Rambam (Hil.Chagigah 1:1) and the Gemara (10b) that the obligation is to offer a sacrifice, not necessarily to eat it. (This is also stated clearly in Mechilta d'Rebbi Shimon bar Yochai, Parshas Bo.) Thus if he sends it with a Shali'ach and does not go to eat it himself, he will have fulfilled the Mitzvah.

Mordecai