MENACHOS 15 (14 Elul) - This Daf has been dedicated in honor of the Yahrzeit of Yisrael (son of Chazkel and Miryam) Rosenbaum who passed away on 14 Elul, by his son and daughter and their families.

1) "PIGUL" OF A "KORBAN TODAH" AND ITS LOAVES
QUESTION: The Mishnah teaches that when one slaughters a Korban Todah with intent to eat the Korban Chutz l'Zemano, the Lechem and the Korban become Pigul. When one slaughters the Korban with intent to eat its accompanying Lachmei Todah Chutz l'Zemano, the Lechem becomes Pigul but not the Korban. The Gemara asks what the Halachah is in a case in which a person slaughters a Todah with intent to eat, Chutz l'Zemano, half of a k'Zayis of the meat and half of a k'Zayis of the Lechem. Will the Lechem become Pigul in such a case? Rav rules that the Lechem becomes Pigul.
The Gemara asks, why should the Lechem become Pigul? It should not become Pigul due to the following Kal va'Chomer: If something that causes Pigul ("Mefagel") does not become prohibited itself as Pigul, then something that attempts to cause Pigul but fails to do so certainly should not become Pigul itself.
RASHI explains that the Gemara refers to the half of a k'Zayis of Todah as the Mefagel, the item that makes the Pigul, since the thought to eat the Todah Chutz l'Zemano causes the Lechem to become Pigul, while the Todah itself does not become Pigul. This is the basis of the Kal va'Chomer that since the thought to eat half a k'Zayis of Lechem Chutz l'Zemano is not able to make the Todah become Pigul, certainly the Lechem itself should not become Pigul.
Why is the half of k'Zayis of the Todah referred to as something that creates Pigul any more than the Chatzi k'Zayis of Lechem? After all, both of them create Pigul in the Lechem and do not create Pigul in the Todah. Accordingly, both should be called items that create Pigul, or both should be called items that do not create Pigul! (PERUSH HA'MEYUCHAS LA'RASHBA)
ANSWER: The PERUSH HA'MEYUCHAS LA'RASHBA answers that the thought to eat the Chatzi k'Zayis of Todah Chutz l'Zemano causes the Lechem to become Pigul, because with regard to causing the Lechem to become Pigul it is considered as though the Todah itself became Pigul. Even though the Todah itself is not actually Pigul, the thought to eat a half of a k'Zayis of the Todah at the wrong time causes the Todah to be considered as though it is Pigul, at least with regard to the Lechem, which is subordinate to the Todah. This is why the thought about the half of k'Zayis of Todah is called a thought that creates Pigul; it creates Pigul in both the Todah and the Lechem, with regard to the Lechem. On the other hand, a thought to eat half of a k'Zayis of Lechem at the wrong time does not affect the Todah itself in any way. Therefore, the thought is called a thought that does not create Pigul, since it does not cause the Lechem and the Todah together to become Pigul. (A similar logic may be applied to the case of the Gefanim and Zera'im discussed in the Gemara here.)

15b----------------------------------------15b

2) THE TYPES OF PLANTS SUBJECT TO THE PROHIBITION OF "KIL'AYIM"
QUESTION: The Gemara relates an incident in which a person sowed the vineyard of another person with seeds, thereby transgressing the Isur of Kil'ayim. The Chachamim ruled that the seeds he sowed are prohibited, but the vines in the vineyard are permitted. The Gemara asks that if the seeds do not prohibit the vines, then they should be permitted themselves. The Gemara answers that the Isur of Kil'ayim in this case is mid'Rabanan. As a way of penalizing the person who attempted to prohibit someone else's vineyard by planting seeds in it, the Rabanan prohibited the seeds. The Gemara explains that the Kil'ayim in this case is prohibited only mid'Rabanan because Kil'ayim d'Oraisa is only "Kanvus" and "Luf." ("Kanvus" is hemp (cannabis), a tall Asiatic herb with tough fiber that is used for making cloth, floor covering, and cords. "Luf" is a type of onion, similar to colocasia, with edible leaves, roots, and beans.)
Does the Gemara mean to say that planting ordinary types of grain (wheat and barley) in a vineyard is not included in the Isur d'Oraisa of Kil'ayim and does not prohibit the vineyard? Which types of plants are subject to the prohibition of Kil'ayim only mid'Rabanan?
ANSWERS:
(a) RABEINU CHAIM KOHEN (cited by the SHITAH MEKUBETZES #2 and #4) explains that the Gemara is not making a statement, but rather it is asking a rhetorical question. The Gemara is asking, "Do you think that only Kanvus and Luf are prohibited by the Torah, and nothing else? Rather, all Zera'im prohibit a vineyard mid'Oraisa, and the reason why the vineyard is permitted in this case is because of the rule that 'Ein Adam Oser Davar she'Eino Shelo,' a person cannot prohibit something that does not belong to him."
According to Rabeinu Chaim, the Gemara is not limiting the Isur of Kil'ayim to any particular plant or plants. Rather, it is saying that all plants are included in the Isur d'Oraisa of Kil'ayim.
(b) TOSFOS (DH v'Hitiru) writes that the Gemara does not mean that wheat, barley, and the other types of grain are not included in the Isur d'Oraisa of Kil'ayim. Rather, the Gemara means that aside from grain, the only other plants that create an Isur of Kil'ayim mid'Oraisa are Kanvus and Luf. (See also RABEINU TAM in SEFER HA'YASHAR #495, and YERE'IM HA'SHALEM #76 and #389.)
(c) The RA'AVAN (#53) and the RAN in Chulin (cited by the TAZ YD 296:1) maintain that the five types of grain, and any other edible produce, are subject to the Isur of Kil'ayim mid'Oraisa. The Gemara here is referring to seeds of plants that generally are not eaten, such as Kanvus and Luf. The Gemara means that the only inedible plants that create Kil'ayim mid'Oraisa are Kanvus and Luf, as the Mishnah in Kil'ayim (5:8) teaches. This might be the intention of the RASH there as well.
(d) The RAMBAN (cited by the TESHUVOS HA'RASHBA (1:448), and in Chulin 82a) explains that any plant can prohibit a vineyard if it is sown in a pre-existing vineyard. However, the Gemara in Chulin (116a) teaches that it is possible to create an Isur Kil'ayim by bringing a plant that is fully grown into a vineyard, such as when the seeds were planted in an Atzitz Nakuv (a perforated pot), and after they grew the pot was placed inside a vineyard (or the contents of the pot were planted in the vineyard). The Gemara teaches that such a plant prohibits the vineyard only if the plant grows in the vineyard an amount equivalent to one part of 200 of its total present volume. The Ramban explains that the Gemara here refers to such a case: a fully-grown plant was planted in the vineyard. In such a case the Chachamim said that only Kanvus and Luf prohibit the vineyard mid'Oraisa, since they are large plants that become difficult to distinguish from the vines in the vineyard. Other plants that were imported into the vineyard, including even wheat, do not prohibit the vineyard through additional growth there. They prohibit the vineyard only when they are planted from seed in the vineyard.
(e) The RA'AVAD (cited by the Ramban and Rashba, loc. cit.) suggests that mid'Oraisa any plant is prohibited to be planted in a vineyard. The Gemara here refers not to the prohibition against planting Kil'ayim; there certainly is a prohibition against planting Kil'ayim. Rather, the Gemara refers to the Halachah that when a field is planted with Kil'ayim, the vines and produce become prohibited to be eaten. The Gemara says that only Kanvus and Luf, and not other plants, cause a vineyard to become prohibited to be eaten.

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