Hi! I very much enjoy the resources provided by the web site. Thank you very much. I came across something that confused me. In sukkah 14b review question 7, it says that according to the lishna achrina according to Shmuel R' meir would PERMIT two planks of three each. Why is that true, the only difference is what the starting assumption is of the braisa - what is the psul being discussed, why would r meir say "ein mitztsarfin"?
Thank you,
Berish
In the first Lashon, the Gemara says (regarding the opinion of Shmuel in Rebbi Meir), "Mitztarfin l'Arba'ah," which means that two planks, of three Tefachim each, combine to render the Sukah Pasul because of Gezeiras Tikrah. In the second Lashon, on the other hand, it says "Mitztarfin l'Arba Amos Min ha'Tzad" with regard to the four Amos of Dofen Akumah at the edge of the Sukah, implying that Rebbi Meir agrees with Rebbi Yehudah that two planks of three Tefachim each do not render the Sukah Pasul, because he doesn't hold of Gezeiras Tikrah.
B'Virchas Kol Tuv,
Eliezer Chrysler
I think you meant mitztarfin at the end of the email not gezeras tikrah (because otherwise r meir would just hold like r Yehuda in our mishna)
But I don't see any such implication. All I see is that the lishna achrina is placing the braisa by daled Amos min hatzad, that doesn't tell me anything regarding daled tefachim be'emtza. There is no indication what r meir would hold, but why would he say mitztarfin by one over the other?
Although I may have misunderstood your question, let me clarify what I wrote.
I wrote that in the second Lashon, Rebbi Meir does not hold of Gezeiras Tikrah and that is what I meant, because in the second Lashon he argues with Rebbi Yehudah over whether planks of three Tefachim plus will render a Sukah Pasul at the side if they add up to more than four Amos or not.
If you check this with the Lashon of the Gemara, you will find that your original question is answered.
B'Virchas Kol Tuv,
Eliezer Chrysler
Thank you Rabbi Chrysler for your patience. Please allow me one follow up though. If Rabbi Meir doesn't hold of gezeras tikrah (in the second lashon), why does he argue on Rabbi Yehuda in the Mishnah? Additionally, why (in the braisa) would they render a sukah pasul at the side if they add up to 4 amos? What is the psul if not gezeras tikrah?
I am only going to relate, bs'd, to your original question for the moment, Berish.
If we look at the two Leshonos in the Gemara, we see that with respect to Shmuel, there is only one difference between the two Leshonos. According to the first Lashon, the two planks of three Tefachim are Mitztaref in the middle of the roof, whereas according to the second loshon they are only Mitztaref on the side of the roof, not in the middle. The fact that the Lishna Achrina states that according to Shmuel they are Mitztaref at the side implies that in the middle they are not Mitztaref.
That is why we wrote that according to the Lishna Achrina, Shmuel says that Rebbi Meir would permit two planks of three each, because we were referring to the middle of the roof, since in the middle of the roof he says Ein Mitztarfin.
B'Hatzlachah Rabah,
Dovid Bloom