More Discussions for this daf
1. Amora'im arguing with Tanna'im? 2. Tosfos DH Keivan 3. Beracha on wine after bentching
4. Korban Pessach is an Affirmation of Emunah 5. Marsa in the Daf Review 6. Brachah on Kos of Birchas Ha'mazon
7. אמוראים חולקים על תנאים 8. תוד"ה ואמר ר' יוחנן 9. תוד"ה כיון
DAF DISCUSSIONS - PESACHIM 103

Abe Murad notes:

Moses with the help of G-d had to re-model this group by giving them all the requirements of a nation. Step one were the plagues. Pharaoh said to Moses "who is the Lord that I must obey now?' G-d brought the plagues so that "Egypt shall know that " I am the Lord". This is to establish the power and sovereignty of G-d.

Step two is to remove them from the Egyptian gods. Rabbi Yose Hagalili said that it was necessary to "Draw out" Mashchou" the populous from idolatry and idolatrous environments. As long as the Israelites worship the Egyptian gods, they shall not forsake their ways and repudiate idolatry.

Israel must perform actions that would symbolize dramatic change, physical, freedom, and spiritual transformation. So the Israelites were commanded "Take you a lamb and slaughter it thereby the gods of Egypt and make them Passover. This action represents defiance to the Egyptian rule and system, as well as a commitment of the Israelites to the new order. The night of Passover represent a separation from the proceeding slavery to freedom. Abandon the past and prepare for the future. To put blood on the doorpost, are they really signs to G-d ?? I venture to say it is more a defiance to the Egyptians, commitment to the new order, and rejection of the Egyptians culture and tradition.. The Rambam's view was "This process was educational in order to effect change not only in social order but spiritual outlook"

The departure from Egypt is not therefore to be understood as a single historic act that once took place, but an affirmation of faith. Rambam goes further to regard that Moses diversion into the wilderness as an educational measure of positive significance to train them for greater tasks in the future. Rambam says that men cannot be expected to fight so called giants after being reared in slavery.

What did Moses do to create this nation? He introduced the principle pillars of the Jewish Faith. They are:

a) The Oneness of G-d. < Monotheism>.

b) The Torah,

c) The election of Israel, < The chosen people>. To establish a nation of priests.

d) The Covenant, < Brith>. " I the Lord am Thy G-d who brought thee out of the Land of Egypt from Slavery" The first of the Ten Commandments and the basis of the Brith.

e) The land

f) The language

Each of these pillars of faith requires commentary not only with regards to their meaning but the great effect they had on the Jewish life during the centuries.

There were two sets of commandments for Pessach. The first set was to govern the community before they left Egypt and it was called Pessach Mizrayim, and this set of commends included the preparation and examination of the lamb (from blemishes 4 days before the 14th of Nissan) and circumcise all males three days earlier. Then they had the command to eat the Pessach lamb, roasted, with Matzo representing the haste in leaving, and Marror representing their affliction in Egypt. The eating of the lamb must be done in full stomach. Some sages include another command to eat Matzo for seven days.

The second sets of commandments were given to the later generations and were called Pessach Doroth. These rules included only the Pessach lamb when the Temple was in existence, Matza and Marror. The emphasis was Shamor and Zachor. Shamor is to live the experience of the exodus from Egypt, by eating Matzo (defined as Lehem Oni) poor man bread and marror to remember the affliction and the freedom that the Israelites gained afterwards. .They were told to observe a seven day Chametz and recite the Magilla which is a recount of the experience. An old Sage wrote:" Pessach Doroth is to instruct the children and the generations by influencing their character through action and constitute the will of G-d."

To update what I have written so far. The Torah mandated the Jews to slaughter a lamb to show the rejection of the old order of the Egyptians, by slaughtering their gods, rejecting their tradition and social order, and an open defiance of the Pharaoh establishment. By circumcising the males and abiding by the Torah, The Israelites affirm their Faith in G-d and acceptance of the new order effecting changes in their social order and their spiritual outlook

If we say that the slaughter of the lamb during Pessach Mizrayim redeemed the Jews of their past sins I disagree, because they did Tshuva and that would redeem them. If not I would say that there was no system in place for Korbanos at that time and until the Mishkan. With all these I say that the whole discussion is not relevant because the Pessach lamb during Pessach Doroth does not redeem anybody of any aberra committed. They are fulfilling a Mitzvah, a Command. So the slaughter of the Pessach lamb is not a Korban, but an affirmation of Faith in G-d and in the Covenant " I am the Lord who took out of the land of Egypt ...."

Even if we try to analyze the Korbanos as known, we find that there are two groups of Korbanos, and some Sages say there are three groups.

The first group is The Chatas, Asham, Ola, etc.. Which are brought by a person who recognized his sin? Admitted his sin, and promised not to do it again, The Korban will affect redemption.

The second groups are the Toda, Nadav, Shlamim. etc. Which are offered as thanks giving?

The third groups are the Nazir, Tsoraath, Isha Yoledeth etc These are people with condition. Some sages say that they have these conditions because of attributed sin, but in the end result they bring Korban and they get their redemption.

Where do you put the Korban Pessach? The Korban must be shared with others contrary to the regular Korban. The lamb must be eaten roasted by the registered group. This is , not a condition for other Korbanos. Zrika effects redemption in all Korbanos, but not in the case of Korban Pessach that requires the registered individuals to eat the Korban. The eating fulfills the commandment

Therefore I come to the conclusion that Korban Pessach is not a Korban in the normal sense a Korban for redemption, but an affirmation of Faith in G-d and the Covenant..

Abe Murad, Montreal, Canada

The Kollel replies:

That is an excellent point, Abe. The