More Discussions for this daf
1. Tosfos Outlines DH Tanya Amar Rebbi Yehudah 2. Meat for man 3. Chacham eating excessivly
4. Source for Se'udas Erusin 5. Am Haaretz 6. Marrying the daughter of a Talmid Chacham
7. Tosfos Outlines DH Tanya Amar R. Yehudah
DAF DISCUSSIONS - PESACHIM 49

Alex Lebovits asked:

"L'olam yimkor adam kol mah shyesh lo, veyisah bas Talmid Chacham"

1. It would seem to me that it's cheaper to marry such a girl as her needs would be less; so what is the money needed for.

2. On a more serious level, the Torah devoted a whole parasha to "wife seeking" and Lavan or Besuel were far from Talmidei Chachamim! Perhaps Shem V'Ever's House would have been a more suitable place to send Eliezer -- or even Eliezer himself or even Mamrei. Yet the Ben Ish Chai explains that the word "l'Olam" comes to tell us that the rule of "bas talmid chochom" overrides all other considerations.

3. Does today's Bais Yaakov System take the place of a TAlmid Chacham when choosing a wife?

4. Is there no maximum "chomesh" consideration here at all?

Asking a question from your Kollel is extremely gratifying. You make a person's question seem even more important by the answers you give them. It is greatly appreciated.

Thank you

Alex Lebovits, Toronto

The Kollel replies:

Alex,

1. This question seems to have been asked in the spirit of the upcoming holiday of Purim, so I will answer in the same spirit. Obviously, the reason the daughter of the Talmid Chacham requires more money is because her father has less! (See BEN YEHOYADA here.)

2. I think the key to this Sugya may be found in RASHI 49b DH Im Kol who writes that the Am ha'Aretz is similar to an animal because he does have a heart that "[the Torah] is your life and the length of your days". This suggests that what the ignorant person does not understand is that the Torah is our lifeblood (although it is not actually the literal meaning of Rashi because "it is your life etc." is actually a quote from the Gemara slightly below).

TAZ (to SHULCHAN ARUCH EH 2:3) explains that the nature of women is to cause their husbands to stop learning Torah because they believe that if they will do business they will enjoy the goods of this world, while if they are busy with Torah they will only enjoy the goods of the Next World. However they are in fact mistaken because "the Torah is your life in this world, and the length of your days in the World To Come which is forever long ." The TAZ learns from this that if an Am ha'Aretz has a daughter who is wise and does understand this point, there is no prohibition of marrying her merely because her father is ignorant.

See RABBEINU BACHYE (Bereishis 24:3) who writes that one may learn from the fact that Avraham looked for a wife for Yitzchak from the family of Besu'el, that there is an advantage of marrying within the family because this enhances harmony. However, I recommend that you see LEV ELIYAHU (by Rav Eliyahu Lopian zt'l) on Chayei Sarah who explains this further. He demonstrates at length that the most important thing to look for in a wife is good Midos (character traits). Avraham knew that the best Midos were to be found in his own family. Even though there were superficial drawbacks with Besu'el and Lavan, nevertheless the basic Midos of the family were good. This is what Eliezer saw in the Chesed that Rivkah displayed, and this is what really contributes to building a family of Tzadikim. In short, the really important factor is the personality of the wife, but this is usually - but not always - influenced by her family.

3. When I was a Choson, I was told that the CHAZON ISH said that a graduate of Bais Yakov nowadays has the Din of the daughter of a Talmid Chacham (and somebody just told me that Rav Aharon Kotler zt'l said the same thing).

I can offer a source for this from PISCHEI TESHUVAH, EH (2:6) who cites BIRKEI YOSEF, who rules based on above-mentioned TAZ that there is nothing wrong with marrying the daughter of a wealthy man who pledges to support his son in law while he learns (if the girl is a Yerei'as Shamayim). Thus, a girl educated in Beis Yaakov ,who has been taught that the main thing in life is that her husband should learn Torah is equivalent to the daughter of a Talmid Chacham.

4. See EIN ELIYAHU who answers that the "one-fifth" principle only applies for a Mitzvah which one will be able to perform at some later date if he does not perform it now. For example, if one does not purchase an Esrog this year because it costs more than 20% of one's possessions, one can still purchase an Esrog next year. In contrast, if one will never do the Mitzvah unless he spends more than 20% of his possessions, one is obligated to spend even more than 20% of his possessions for the Mitzvah.

In fact there is a source for this in the Poskim- Teshovos AVNEI NEZER EH 1:9 writes that if a person will never fulfill the Mitzvah of Pru u'Revu unless he spends more than 1/5 of his possessions for it, he is obligated to spend as much money as necessary to perform the Mitzvah.

Purim Same'ach!

Dovid Bloom

Alex Lebovits asked:

"L'olam yimkor adam kol mah shyesh lo, veyisah bas Talmid Chacham"

1. Is there no maximum "chomesh" consideration here at all?

2. The Torah devoted a whole parasha to "wife seeking" and Lavan or Besuel were far from Talmidei Chachamim! Perhaps Shem V'Ever's House would have been a more suitable place to send Eliezer -- or even Eliezer himself or even Mamrei. Yet the Ben Ish Chai explains that the word "l'Olam" comes to tell us that the rule of "bas talmid chochom" overrides all other considerations.

Asking a question from your Kollel is extremely gratifying. You make a person's question seem even more important by the answers you give them. It is greatly appreciated.

Thank you

Alex Lebovits, Toronto

The Kollel replies:

Follow up to pesachim 49

1. I asked a Godol, Shlita, your question - why does the Gemara say that one should sell everything one owns in order to marry the daughter of a Talmid Chacham if the Halachah is that one should only give one fifth of one's possessions in order to perform a positive commandment(see SHULCHAN ARUKH OC 656 in Rema) - and getting married is a positive commandment in order to have children?

The Godol answered "Keday She-lo yiskalkelu bonov" i.e. "in order that one's children should not leave the way of the Torah". This means that even though one need only spend a fifth in order to "Mekayem" a positive commandment, nevertheless one has to forfeit all of one's belongings in order to prevent one's children from leaving the Torah. The Gemara says (Pesachim 49a) that if someone marries the daughter of an ignorant person, if afterwards he should die or go into exile his children will also remain ignorant and will therefore not know how to keep the Torah. This means they will transgress negative commandments and one is obliged to give all one's money to avoid transgressing negative commandments. (see above SHULCHAN ARUKH)

2. I also asked him another question which was very similar to one of your questions. The Torah says( Bereshis 24:49) that Eliezer requested of Rivka's family to inform him if they were agreeable that she should marry Yitzchak, and if not they should tell him "and I will turn to the right or to the left". RASHI explains that "to the right" means to look for a wife from the daughters of Yishmael while "to the left" refers to searching amongst the daughters of Lot. My question was - why not go for a daughter of Shem or Ever, who were the Rashei Yeshivos at the time, and this way one would get the daughter of a Talmid Chacham for Yitzchak?

The Godol answered that "Lifnei Mattan Torah lo shayach bas Talmid Chacham" i.e. before the Torah was given there was no status of a Talmid Chacham, so our Gemara about marrying the daughter of a Talmid Chacham was not yet applicable.

YE-YASHER KOACH

R. Dovid Bloom