More Discussions for this daf
1. Shitas Rashi and Tosfos 2. Bracha Al Biur Chametz 3. R. Yose Hagelili
4. The Beer Controversy

Meir Levy asked:

1. Does Tos' agree w/ rashi that the sugyah of shchikah is dealing with takalah and not the mitzva of tashbisu?

2. Does rashi agree with Tos' that R' yosef holds that you don't need to do shchika w/ avodah zara in the yam hamelach?

thank you very much!

Meir Levy, La Jolla, USA

The Kollel replies:


1. Yes, the term Shechikah only applies to metal, and in this case refers to Avodah Zarah. According to Tosfos, Rabah's answer to the Beraisa which teaches that Shechikah is necessary by Avodah Zarah is that although the *Mishnah* may be assumed to be discussing Yam ha'*Melach*, because of the many Mishnayos that mention it with regard to Avodah Zarah (see Tosfos DH Chametz), the *Beraisa* that discusses Shechikah of Avodah Zarah is addressing Avodah Zarah that is thrown into a normal river.

2. There is a slight indication in Rashi DH Tanya Kavasei d'Rav Yosef that he disagrees with Tosfos on this point. However, that does not necessarily mean that he holds one may not even grind Avodah Zarah into other rivers (as Tosfos assumes in his Hava Amina). Rashi may hold that according to Rav Yosef, there is nothing unique about Yam ha'Melach with regard to Avodah Zarah; Shechikah must be done for both it and other rivers. This is in fact the opinion of the Ba'al ha'Me'or, see also Chidushei ha'Ran.

M. Kornfeld

The Kollel adds:

Rashi writes twice that the fear is that someone will find the Chametz if you are not Mefarer which seems to say that the problem is Takalah.

As for Yam haMelach, as Tosfos writes, the Sugya implies that you need Shecikah even in the Yam ha'Melach, but Tosfos brings proofs that this cannot be true. There is no Mashma'us from Rashi, but the Beis Yosef and Darkei Moshe and most Acharonim write like Tosfos (that only other waters need Shechikah) while the Bach (Yoreh De'ah #146). writes that even Yam ha'Melach needs Shechikah.

D. Zupnik