More Discussions for this daf
1. Edim Zomemim who tried to whip a weak person 2. Given lashes to a weak person 3. Reducing Lashes
4. How to give Makos? 5. Rishonim correcting the Lashon and altering meaning of the Gemara? 6. Rishonim correcting the Lashon and altering meaning of the Gemara?
DAF DISCUSSIONS - MAKOS 22

Daniel Lichtman asked:

I think I understand the basic procedure to give the makos but i do not understand how they were to be administered to women who were to be lashed? I am confused because of another gemara in sotah on 8a where it discusses how the sotah was to be punished and it discusses there with the same words it uses in makos that you are to rip the clothes and if they rip your not obligated to pay for the damage, and then discusses how this was to be done becasue this women was not going to be wearing upper garments. In makos there is no discussion and I was wondering why and more basically how did they give the women makos if they could not look at them?

Daniel Lichtman, schenectady, ny, usa

The Kollel replies:

Maharil Diskin (Rav of Brisk and Yerushlayim) discusses this question (in Toras Ohel Moshe). He suggests that in the case of Sotah if we do not tear her clothes we have not negated the whole Mitzvah, because the woman still drinks the water which is the main part of the Mitzvah. However if we do not tear the clothes of a lady who deserves Malkos we have not kept the Mitzvah of Malkos, since the Torah says we must give the Malkos on the person's body, not on their clothes (see Rambam Sanhedrin 16:8). See also Minchah Chareivah for a similar approach and a lengthy discussion of the issue. However, this will not answer the question according to Tosfos (Sotah 8a DH v'ha'Kohen).

As for how they could give the Malkos, I would suggest that this is similar to the Gemara in Bava Basra 57b, that when there is no other option, there is no obligation to shut one's eyes.

[Perhaps we can answer that for the Kohanim who are actually involved with administering the Malkos or Misah or Hashka'as Sotah there is no problem of Hirhur, as the Gemara says in Avodah Zarah (20b) based on the principle that there is no Hirhur Aveirah when a person is involved in his work. The problem of Hirhur is exclusive to spectators who are otherwise uninvolved. In the case of Malkos we can exclude any further spectators and hence there is no problem with tearing the woman's clothing. However, in the case of Misas Beis Din, we cannot exclude spectators due to the Mitzvah of v'Chol ha'Am Yishme'u v'Yira'u. Similarly in the case of Sotah we cannot exclude spectators due to the Pasuk of v'Nivasru Kol ha'Nashim (see Tosfos Sotah 8a DH v'Yisgaru). However, it seems that the Mitzvah of v'Chol ha'Am Yishme'u v'Yira'u does not apply to all Misos Beis Din, see Sanhedrin 89a.]

Dov Freedman