More Discussions for this daf
1. Rabah in the bathtub 2. Last Section of Agadah 3. Rabbi Shimon and Muktzah
4. Measuring a barrel 5. Rabbah bar Rav Huna's answer on final daf 6. Ending
7. The last five lines 8. Siyum for Meseches Shabbos 9. Measuring on Shabbos
DAF DISCUSSIONS - SHABBOS 157

abe deutsch asked:

Meseches shabbos seems to end very strangely. A tanna or an amora is saying 'I wasn't really concentrating on what I was doing'.

Isn't this a bit anticlimactic after a whole mesechta??

Thanks

abe deutsch, Cligton,NJ

The Kollel replies:

It seems to me that Rabah bar Rav Huna was concentrating very hard on what he was doing. He deliberately began measuring something that was unnecessary, to teach us that this is permitted. Tana'im and Amora'im often taught Halachos in a practical way (rather than verbally), because it makes a more lasting impression (perhaps this is even an extension of the statement 'Ma'aseh Rav' [an act is more powerful than words], as well as of learning from the idle talk of Talmidei-Chachamim).

Incidentally, this makes for a nice connection with the beginning of the Masechta (which is commonly done when making a Siyum [maybe because 'Hadran Alach' means 'I will return to you').

In contrast to the opening Mishnah, where the Ashir is Chayav even though his sole intention is to perform a Mitzvah (because it is a case of 'P'sik Reisha'), here (even though it is 'P'sik Reisha') he is permitted to do it, because the Rabbanan did not extend the Isur of measuring to where it is not needed (like we learned with regard to Cheshbonos shel Mah-be'Kach in the previous Perek).

Wishing you and yours a G'mar Chasimah Tovah.

be'Virchas Kol Tuv

Eliezer Chrysler

Alan Schoffman responds:

I am puzzled by the above reference to 'Psik Reisha' in the beginning of Maseches Shabbos. How does this fit in with its classical meaning that something permitted was intended but there was an unintended inevitable consequence?

Gmar Chatimah Tovah.

Thank you.

Alan Schoffman

The Kollel replies:

You're quite right. This is not really a case of P'sik Reisha, seeing as he intends to perform an act for which he will be Chayav. I nevertheless used the term, since it helps clarify the point I was making, and brings out the contrast between the two cases under discussion.

be'Virchas Kol Tuv

Eliezer Chrysler

abe deutsch responds:

Thanks.

However is this permitted lechitchila? Usually the lack of machsovah just exempts from a chiuv bedeved.

Furthermore if he was doing this for a teaching purpose, then his action\contradictorily did have a purpose!!

I'm surprised that the is not discussed by the commentaries.

The Kollel replies:

You're quite right. This is not really a case of P'sik Reisha, seeing as he intends to perform an act for which he will be Chayav. I nevertheless used the term without thinking properly. Actually, it does help clarify the point I was making, and brings out the contrast between the two cases under discussion.

Sorry if I misled you.

be'Virchas Kol Tuv

Eliezer Chrysler.