More Discussions for this daf
1. The rich people of Mechuza 2. Nivul Peh 3. Rav Shimon Bar Yochai Burning People
4. Reb Shimon bar Yochai 5. Bitul Torah 6. Yaakov - "Vayichon Es Pnei ha'Ir"
7. Punishment Order for Not Taking Ma'asar 8. Sechar v'Onesh 9. גלות בא לעולם
DAF DISCUSSIONS - SHABBOS 33

Dan Isroel Abittan asked:

on lines 14 to 17 of daf 33 amud beis, the gemara discusses the reasons why a person is attained by the awfull sickness of "ASCARAH". Rav Elazar and Rav Yehuda say that one gets it for speaking lashon hara and for eating Tevel. But comes in Rav Shimon and he says that one gets it for bitul torah.

Then they try to disprove him with "women" since they dont have the avera of bittul torah but they are nevertheless still affected by this sickness and then rav shimon defended that by saying that women get it when they do bittul torah to their husband. Then they (Reb Elazar and Reb Yehuda) tried to disprove reb Shimon with "nochrim" and children, because they have no avon of bitul torah but they are nevertheless affected by the sickness.

So my Shayla is how can reb yehuda and reb elazar explain why nochrim and children are affected by this sickness? In other words, nochrim and children are not commanded against eating tevel or speaking lashin Hara, so even according to reb yehuda or reb elzar, goym and children shouldnt get ascarah at all!!??!!!

Im waiting anxiously for your teirutz,

Thanks alot,

Dan Isroel Abittan, Montreal/ Canada

The Kollel replies:

None of the reasons given by the Gemara apply to Nochrim, yet they suffer from Askarah.

Clearly then, the sin and punishment under discussion is confined to Yisrael, and does not pertain to Nochrim.

Likewise, children are not punishable for their own sins, only for those of their parents, in which case, if children do die by Askarah, it is to be assumed that it is because their parents sinned in one of the above ways.

Be'Virchas Kol Tuv

Eliezer Chrysler