CHULIN 31-43 - Two weeks of study material have been dedicated by Mrs. Estanne Abraham Fawer to honor the Yahrzeit of her father, Rav Mordechai ben Eliezer Zvi (Rabbi Morton Weiner) Z'L, who passed away on 18 Teves 5760. May the merit of supporting and advancing Dafyomi study -- which was so important to him -- during the weeks of his Yahrzeit serve as an Iluy for his Neshamah.

1)

(a)Rebbi rules in a Beraisa that if someone Shechts, and blood squirts from the animal's neck on to a detached pumpkin of Terumah, the pumpkin is Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah. What does Rebbi Chiya say?

(b)On what basis does Rebbi Oshaya cite Rebbi Shimon in this matter?

(c)What does Rav Papa say about a case where the blood remains on the pumpkin until the termination of the Shechitah?

(d)If, as he explains, they argue over a case where the blood is wiped off the pumpkin before the Shechitah has been completed, what is the basis of their Machlokes? Why does ...

1. ... Rebbi Chiya say that the pumpkin is not Muchshar?

2. ... Rebbi say that it is?

1)

(a)Rebbi rules in a Beraisa that if someone Shechts and blood squirts from the animal's neck on to a detached pumpkin of Terumah, the pumpkin is Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah. Rebbi Chiya holds - Tolin (it hangs in the balance [which will be explained shortly]).

(b)Rebbi Oshaya cites Rebbi Shimon - in support of Rebbi Chiya, as we will see.

(c)Rav Papa states that in a case where the blood remains on the pumpkin until the termination of the Shechitah - even Rebbi Chiya will hold that the pumpkin is Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah ...

(d)... and they argue over a case where the blood is wiped off the pumpkin before the Shechitah has been completed. Rebbi ...

1. ... Chiya says that the pumpkin is not Muchshar - because he holds Einah li'Shechitah Ela be'Sof (and the blood is Dam Mageftah).

2. ... says that it is - because he holds Yeshnah li'Shechitah mi'Techilah ve'Ad Sof, (in which case the blood is considered Dam Shechitah).

2)

(a)What does Rebbi Oshaya then mean when he says 'Bo'u Ve'nismoch al Divrei Rebbi Shimon', seeing as Rebbi Shimon holds in principle, that Dam Shechitah is not Machshir, whereas Rebbi Chiya holds that it is?

(b)Rav Ashi disagrees with Rav Papa's explanation however. How does *he* interpret the Tolin of Rebbi Chiya?

(c)What are the two sides to his Safek?

(d)What does Rebbi Oshaya now mean when he says 'Bo'u ve'Nismach al Divrei Rebbi Shimon', seeing as Rebbi Shimon holds that Dam Shechitah is not Machshir, whereas Rebbi Chiya holds that it is?

2)

(a)When Rebbi Oshaya says 'Bo'u Ve'nismoch al Divrei Rebbi Shimon' (despite the fact that Rebbi Shimon holds on principle that Dam Shechitah is not Machshir, whereas Rebbi Chiya holds that it is), he means that - they both agree in this case, where the blood is wiped off, that it is not Muchshar (leaving Rebbi in the minority).

(b)Rav Ashi disagrees with Rav Papa's explanation however. According to him, the Tolin of Rebbi Chiya implies - permanently, because he is basically uncertain whether the Halachah is Yeshno li'Shechitah mi'Techilah ve'ad Sof or Eino ... , in which case neither may the Kohen eat the pumpkin, nor can he burn it ...

(c)... he cannot eat it in case we rule Yeshno li'Shechitah mi'Techilah ve'ad Sof, and he cannot burn it - in case we hold Einah li'Shechitah ... .

(d)And when Rebbi Oshaya now says 'Bo'u ve'Nismach al Divrei Rebbi Shimon', what he means is that - (even though Rebbi Shimon holds that Dam Shechitah is not Machshir, whereas Rebbi Chiya holds that it is), they both agree that the pumpkin cannot be burned (leaving Rebbi in the minority).

3)

(a)Resh Lakish asks whether the Din of Rishon and Sheini apply to a Tz'rid shel Menachos. What is ...

1. ... Tz'rid shel Menachos?

2. ... Chibas ha'Kodesh?

(b)What is then Resh Lakish's She'eilah?

(c)What does the Beraisa learn from the Pasuk in Shemini (in connection with Hechsher Ochel Lekabeil Tum'ah) "mi'Kol ha'Ochel asher Ye'achel asher Yavo alav Mayim Yitma"?

(d)What does Rebbi Elazar try to prove from there?

3)

(a)Resh Lakish asks whether the Din of Rishon and Sheini apply to a Tz'rid shel Menachos ...

1. ... lumps of dry flour pertaining to a Minchah with which the oil did not make contact.

2. Chibas ha'Kodesh is - the Kedushah that renders Kodshei Mizbe'ach Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah even without contact with water or one of the seven liquids.

(b)Resh Lakish's She'eilah is - whether Chibas ha'Kodesh gives the Hekdesh article the same Din as food that became Muchshar through contact with water (which makes it a Rishon, and what touches it [the Rishon], a Sheini), or whether it merely gives it a Din of P'sul ha'Guf (which is not Metamei others).

(c)The Beraisa learns from the Pasuk in Shemini (in connection with Hechsher Ochel Lekabeil Tum'ah) "mi'Kol ha'Ochel asher Ye'achel asher Yavo alav Mayim Yitma" that - only food that has contact with water is Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah.

(d)Rebbi Elazar tries to prove from there that - a Tz'rid shel Menachos does not have a Din of Rishon and Sheini.

4)

(a)How do we refute Rebbi Elazar's proof from the Pasuk (that the Din of Hechsher Mayim is confined to food that has contact with water)?

(b)What is Rebbi Elazar's real reason for resolving the She'eilah from the above Beraisa?

(c)How do we refute that too? Why do we need two Pesukim for Hechsher Mayim?

(d)Having taught us Hechsher Mayim by Tum'as ...

1. ... Meis, why does the Torah then need to repeat it by Tum'as Sheretz?

2. ... Sheretz, why does the Torah then need to repeat it by Tum'as Meis?

4)

(a)We refute Rebbi Elazar's proof from the Beraisa (that the Din of Hechsher Mayim is confined to food that has contact with water) however - on the grounds that Resh Lakish also knew that Pasuk, and his She'eilah was whether Chibas ha'Kodesh has the same severity as water in this regard or not.

(b)Rebbi Elazar's real reason for resolving the She'eilah from the above Beraisa is - the fact that having stated "ve'Chi Yutan Mayim al Zera", "mi'Kol ha'Ochel asher Ye'achel" is superfluous, and therefore comes to teach us that the Din of Rishon and Sheini are confined to food that has contact with water, but does not extend to Chibas ha'Kodesh.

(c)We refute that too, however in that we need the two Pesukim - one to teach us Hechsher Mayim by Tum'as Meis, and the other, by Tum'as Sheretz.

(d)Having taught us Hechsher Mayim by Tum'as ...

1. ... Meis (which is Metamei only with a Shi'ur k'Zayis), the Torah nevertheless needs to repeat it by Tum'as Sheretz - which is Metamei with the smaller Shi'ur of k'Adashah (the size of a lentil), which we would therefore have otherwise thought does not require Hechsher Mayim.

2. ... Sheretz (which is Metamei for only one day), the Torah still finds it necessary to repeat it by Tum'as Meis - which is Metamei for seven days.

36b----------------------------------------36b

5)

(a)What do we extrapolate from Rebbi Shimon in our Mishnah 'Huchsheru bi'Shechitah', which seems to resolve Resh Lakish's She'eilah (and pose a Kashya on Rebbi Elazar, too)?

(b)Shamai rules that grapes that one picks for wine-making, are Huchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah. Why is that?

(c)Hillel ultimately agrees with Shamai. But what did he say initially?

(d)Why does Rebbi Zeira, who also makes the same observation from here as Rav Yosef did from the previous Beraisa, not consider the grapes Ochel ha'Ba be'Mayim?

5)

(a)We extrapolate from Rebbi Shimon in our Mishnah 'Huchsheru bi'Shechitah' - even to count Rishon and Sheini (in spite of the fact that the animals were not Huchsheru by means of water) thereby resolving Resh Lakish's She'eilah and posing a Kashya on Rebbi Elazar, at one and the same time).

(b)Shamai rules that grapes that one picks for wine-making are Huchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah - due to the juice that oozes from the grapes.

(c)Hillel ultimately agrees with Shamai. Initially however - he ruled Lo Huchsh'ru.

(d)Rebbi Zeira, who makes the same observation from here as Rav Yosef did from the previous Beraisa, does not consider the grapes Ochel ha'Ba be'Mayim - because the owner does not want the juice to drip out from the grapes, since it merely goes to waste.

6)

(a)On what grounds does Abaye reject the proofs of both Rav Yosef and Rebbi Zeira?

(b)Why did the Rabbanan issue such a decree in the case of Shamai?

(c)What is the difference whether the Terumah grapes are a Rishon min ha'Torah or only mi'de'Rabbanan?

6)

(a)Abaye rejects the proofs of both Rav Yosef and Rebbi Zeira - on the grounds that the Hechsher Mayim in both of the above cases is only mi'de'Rabbanan.

(b)The reason that the Rabbanan issued such a decree in the case of Shamai is - because they suspected that one might then come to pick the grapes with closed baskets, which do not allow the juice to drain.

(c)The difference whether the Terumah grapes are a Rishon min ha'Torah or only mi'de'Rabbanan - lies in the obligation to burn them, which does not apply to Tum'ah mi'de'Rabbanan,

7)

(a)What objection does Rav Yosef raise to Abaye's answer ...

1. ... to his own Kashya (from Shechitah) that Rishon and Sheini by Shechitah is only mi'de'Rabbanan?

2. ... to Rebbi Zeira's Kashya (from 'ha'Botzer le'Gas')?

(b)What does Abaye answer? How did he qualify Resh Lakish's She'eilah?

(c)On what basis do we then extrapolate that Chibas ha'Kodesh must be d'Oraysa?

7)

(a)Rav Yosef's objection to Abaye's answer ...

1. ... to his Kashya (from Shechitah) that Rishon and Sheini by Shechitah is only mi'de'Rabbanan is that - when Rebbi Shimon said 'Huchsheru bi'Shechitah', he seems to have meant mi'd'Oraysa, and not mi'de'Rabbanan.

2. ... to Rebbi Zeira's Kashya (from 'ha'Botzer le'Gas') is that - in that case, perhaps by Tz'rid shel Menachos too, the Chachamim issued a decree (rendering Resh Lakish's She'eilah groundless).

(b)To which Abaye replied that - this is indeed the case, and Resh Lakish was not asking about Terumah or Kodesh that touched the Tz'rid shel Menachos becoming a Sheini, but about whether one is obligated to burn them or not.

(c)And we extrapolate that Chibas ha'Kodesh must therefore be d'Oraysa - because otherwise, it would certainly be forbidden to burn them (as we learned a little earlier).

8)

(a)Bearing in mind that the Pasuk in Shemini "ve'ha'Basar asher Yiga be'Chol Tamei" is referring to Kodshim, how do we know that the Basar did not become Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah through ...

1. ... its own blood (or through that of other Kodshim animals)?

2. ... the water with which they would wash the Kodshim animals in the Beis ha'Mitbachayim?

(b)What else did Rebbi Yossi b'Rebbi Chanina say about Mashkei bei Matb'chaya?

(c)We nevertheless reject the proof from there that Chibas ha'Kodesh is d'Oraysa, based on a statement of Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel. How did Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel establish the Pasuk in Shemini?

8)

(a)Bearing in mind that the Pasuk in Shemini "ve'ha'Basar asher Yiga be'Chol Tamei" is referring to Kodshim, we know that the Basar did not become Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah through ...

1. ... its own blood (or through that of other Kodshim animals) - because as we learned earlier in the name of Rebbi Chiya bar Aba Amar Rebbi Yochanan, the blood of Kodshim is not Machshir.

2. ... the water with which they would wash the Kodshim animals in the Beis ha'Mitbechayim - because, as stated by Rebbi Yossi b'Rebbi Chanina Mashkei bei Matb'chaya is not Machshir ...

(b)... and is not subject to Tum'ah, either.

(c)We nevertheless reject the proof from there that Chibas ha'Kodesh is d'Oraysa, based on a statement of Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel - who establishes the Pasuk in Shemini where the owner, on the way to Yerushalayim, led the cow that he was bringing as a Shelamim, through a stream of water, and the water was still on it when he later Shechted it (which is how it became Muchshar Lekabeil Tum'ah min ha'Torah).

9)

(a)What do we learn from the word "ve'ha'Basar"(in the Pasuk in Tzav "ve'ha'Basar, Kol Tahor Yochal Basar")?

(b)What problem do we have with this D'rashah?

(c)So what do we learn from there?

(d)What is the conclusion of Resh Lakish's She'eilah (whether we count Rishon and Sheini by Chibas ha'Kodesh or not)?

9)

(a)We learn from the word "ve'ha'Basar"(in the Pasuk in Tzav "ve'ha'Basar, Kol Tahor Yochal Basar") - that even wood and Levonah of Hekdesh are subject to Tum'ah.

(b)The problem with this D'rashah is that - the Pasuk is referring to Tum'as Ochlin, and seeing that wood and frankincense are not food, on what grounds are they included?

(c)So we learn from there - that Chibas ha'Kodesh must be the factor that is Machshir them to be Mekabeil Tum'ah. By the same token then, it is also Machshir dry Kodshim (such as Tz'rid shel Menachos) Lekabeil Tum'ah.

(d)The conclusion of Resh Lakish's She'eilah (whether we count Rishon and Sheini by Chibas ha'Kodesh or not) is - Teiku.

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