Previous Daf

SHABBOS 80

Ask A Question

1)
(a) The Beraisa gives the Shi'ur for carrying wet ink which is already on the tip of a pen on Shabbos, as sufficient ink to write two letters of the alphabet - and the same Shi'ur pertains to dry ink, or ink which is still in the ink-well.
(b) Rava asks whether one will be Chayav for carrying enought to write one letter-volume of each - a She'eilah which remains unresolved.

2)
(a) Rava declares someone who writes two letters whilst he is walking, Chayav - (even though he did not stop) because placing the ink on the paper is called a Hanachah.
(b) He also declares Patue someone who carries out sufficient ink to write one letter, writes the first one on paper, and then fetches ink for the second letter, which he proceeds to write beside the first one - because when the first letter dried, there was no Shi'ur, and when he carried out the second drop of ink, he was not carrying a Shiur either.
(c) Ravs states that someone who carries out a half-ki'G'rogeres of food, puts it down, and then goes and carries another half-ki'G'rogeres and places it beside the first is - Patur.
(d) The problem with this ruling is obvious, in which case he must be speaking where he picked up the first half before placing the second one (which is similar to the previous case).

3)
(a) If, instead of placing the second half-ki'G'rogeres beside the first, he passes it over the top of it, Rava rules that he is Chayav (even though he did not put the second half-G'rogeres down) - because he passed it within three Tefachim of the first half (and whatever is within three Tefachim is considered Munach [placed]).
(b) When, in another statement, Rava said that, according to the Rabbanan, even an article which passes within three Tefachim of the ground, requires a Hanachah on something (though it does not require an area that is three by three Tefachim) - he is speaking specifically about an object that is thrown (where here, he is speaking about one that he is holding in his hand, which is considered as if it was Munach, since it is within three Tefachim of the ground, as we learned in the first Perek).
(c) The Beraisa states 'Hotzi Chatzi G'rogeres, ve'Chazar ve'Hotzi Chatzi G'rogeres, be'He'elam Achad, Chayav ... Rebbi Yossi Omer, be'He'elam Echad li'Reshus Echad, Chayav; li'Sh'tei Reshuyos, Patur'. According to Rabbah, Rebbi Yossi holds that someone who carries out two half-Shiurim to two Reshuyos, is Patur, only if there is a Reshus ha'Yachid dividing between the two Reshus ha'Rabim; according to Abaye, even a Karmelis will suffice. According to Rava - even if no more than a piece of wood divides between the two Reshuyos (so that if one carries one half-Shiur to one side of the piece of wood, and the other half-Shiur to the other side, he will be Patur [provided the piece of wood stretches right across the street, cutting it in two]).
(d) When Rava says 'Reshus Shabbos ki'Reshus Gitin Damya' - he is referring to the case of a man who lends his wife a place in his courtyard, to enable her to receive her Get. He then throws the Get to where she is standing in the courtyard, but it rolls on to a piece of wood, in which case she is not divorced, because the man lent her one place in his courtyard, and not two. From here we see that a piece of wood (which we presume, stretched across his yard), is called an independent domain (the source for Rava's current ruling.

4)
(a) Despite the fact that most women paint both eyes, one is Chayav for carrying out enough eye-paint to paint one - because it it is common for women who are particularly modest, to cover one eye, and paint only the other one.
(b) Rebbi Shimon ben Elazar, who says that it is only if one carries out eye-paint to use as a cure, that one is Chayav for carrying enough for one eye, but if it is to use as a cosmetic, one is only Chayav for carrying out enough to paint two eyes - is speaking about women who live in villages (or in small towns), where the level of morality is higher, and the need for excessive modesty does not exist. Consequently, they never cover one eye, and all their women always paint two eyes.

5)
(a) The Shiur for carrying out glue is - sufficient to smear on the surface of a bird trap (where they would also place seeds, so that, when the birds would alight on the board to peck the seeds, their feet would become stuck to the glue).
(b) According to the text in our Mishnah, a Shiur for a broken piece of earthenware according to the Tana Kama is one that is large enough to make a hole in and cover the opening of a goldsmith's furnace. whereas according to Rebbi Yehudah- it is a piece that is large enough to make the leg of the tripod of a furnace.
(c) This is inconsistent with their previous Machlokes regarding a reed - where Rebbi Yehudah gave the Shiur as long enough to make a sample shoelace for a small child's shoe, which is a smaller Shiur than that of the Rabbanan, who give the Shiur as long enough to use as a hook for a sieve (whereas here, Rebbi Yehudah's Shi'ur is larger).
(d) In order to conform with the previous Machlokes, we amend the opinion of Rebbi Yehudah in the current Machlokes - from the leg of the tripod of a gold-smith's furnace, to filling in the cracks of its leg, which is a far smaller Shiur, even than the Shiur of the Rabbanan.

6)
(a) The Shiur for carrying out ...
1. ... hair on Shabbos - is the amount that one would need to mix sufficient cement to make a mouth-piece for a goldsmith's furnace ...
2. ... which is also the Shiur for carrying out the cement itself.

7)
(a) The Shiur for carrying out lime (plaster) on Shabbos - is enough to smear on the little finger of one's little daughter.
(b) Wealthy people tended to use - flour to remove premature hair from their little daughters.
(c) Kings tended to use Sateches - myrrh-oil. According to others, they would use the oil made from olives that were not yet one third ripe.
(d) A certain Nochri accused Rav Bibi of killing his daughter - because she died after, taking his cue from Rav Bibi, he smeared her entire body with lime. The Nochri erred however, inasmuch as he smeared his daughter's entire body at one time, whereas Rav Bibi did it one limb at a time.

8)
(a) According to Rebbi Yehudah, the Shiur for carrying out lime is 'Kilkel', and according to Rebbi Nechemyah, it is 'Undifi'.
1. 'Kilkel' is - a temple-pack (that a woman smears on her temples to keep her hair flat).
2. ... 'Undifi' (according to our initial understanding is - a pack that one places below the temples, to remove small strands of hair.
(b) When we say that Rebbi Yehudah's Shiur is both larger and smaller, we mean - that it is larger than the Shiur of Rebbi Nechemyah, but smaller than that of the Rabbanan (who give the Shiur as sufficient to smear on a young girl's little finger).
(c) We retract from this interpretation of Undifi, on the basis of the Beraisa, which describes Kilkel as being in the form of liquid lime, and Undifi as eggs in the form of plaster. Now according to the previous interpretation of Undifi, why should Undifi not take the same liquid form as Kilkel?
(d) So we interpret Undifi as 'Andifa' - an earthenware wine-container, which had two holes, one on top (to pour in the wine) and one, below (from which to pour out). When filling it, one would block the lower hole - with a plaster egg (According to this explanation, Rebbi Yehudah's Shiur is even smaller than Rebbi Nechemyah's). We reject this interpretation however, on the grounds that nobody would use such a container for wine, since the plaster egg absorbs the wine, and to use such a vessel would constitute a waste of good wine.

9)
(a) We finally offer two interpretations of Undifi - Sh'nasos and Andifa Apusa.
1. Sh'nasos is - markers in a measuring vessel; e.g. a quarter-liter, a half-liter, one liter ... And these would be chalked in with a plaster egg.
2. Andifa Apusa is - smearing the forehead (where there is no hair) which they would do with a plaster-egg (in order to give the skin there a sheen).
(b) When a certain Galilean died from a hornet sting, they said that it served him right - because he should not have Darshened the Ma'aseh ha'Merkavah in public, thereby contravening the Mishnah says in Chagigah.

10)
(a) According to Rebbi Akiva, the Shiur for carrying out red clay on Shabbos, is enough to seal a large commercial sack, and for manure and fine sand, enough to fertilize one cabbage-stalk; according to the Rabbanan, the Shiur for carrying ...
1. ... red clay - is enough to seal a letter;
2. ... for manure and fine sand - to fertilize a leek.
(b) The Shiur for ...
1. ... thick sand - is the amount that one adds to a trowel-full of lime.
2. ... a thin cane - is to make a quill.
3. ... a thick or split cane - is enough to use as fuel to boil an egg that cooks easily.
(c) The Gemara thinks that the author of our Mishnah must be Rebbi Yehudah - because he is the one who holds that thick sand improves the lime (since he forbids one to whitewash one's house with lime, even when thick sand has been added to it; whereas the Rabbanan permit it, if thick sand or straw has been added).
(d) We conclude that the author might well be the Rabbanan; and it is due to the fact that thick sand spoils the lime, that one is permitted to use it to whitewash one's house - which in turn, is the reason that that is the Shiur for which one is Chayav on Shabbos ('Kilkulo Zehu Tikuno').

11)
(a) The Beraisa gives the Shiur for a fine cane as sufficient to be able to fashion with it a quill that will reach the joints of his fingers. This either means that it reaches the middle joint of the hand (where the finger meets the hand) - or that it reaches the first joint of the forefinger. This She'eilah remains unresolved.
(b) Our Mishnah gave the Shiur for thick sand as sufficient to cook a Beitzah Kalah ... Terufah u'Nesunah be'Ilfas' - which means that the egg has already been scrambled with oil and placed in a pan ready to heat up.

12)
(a) The Shiur for thick sand is sufficient to cook a Beitzah Kalah ... Terufah u'Nesunah be'Ilfas'. The egg is mixed - with oil.
(b) Mar Brei de'Ravina's son thought that the 'Beitzah Kalah' must be referring to the egg of a bird called 'Tziltz'la - because he took 'Beitzah Kalah' to mean the egg of the lightest (i.e. smallest) bird. A Tziltz'la is in fact, a kind of locust.
(c) Mar Brei de'Revina however, disagrees with his son on this point. It appears that there is a bird even smaller than a Tziltz'la (though that is not the reason that he disagrees with him). He therefore explain 'Beitzah Kalah' to mean - the egg that is the quickest to cook (a chicken's egg).
(d) The Shiur of food is indeed always that of a ki'G'rogeres - and what the Tana therefore means when he gives the Shiur of a chicken's egg is (not the Shiur of an entire egg, but) - a ki'Gerogeres of a chicken's egg.

Next Daf