KESUVOS 62 (10 Elul) - This Daf has been dedicated in memory of Sheina Basha (daughter of Yakov and Dora) Zuckerman, who passed away on 10 Elul, by her children and sons in law.

1)

(a)What does ...

1. ... Rav learn from the Pasuk in Divrei ha'Yamim (regarding the servants of David ha'Melech) "l'Chol Devar ha'Machlokes Chodesh b'Chodesh ... "?

2. ... Rebbi Yochanan learn from the Pasuk in Melachim (regarding the building of the Beis ha'Mikdash) "Chodesh Yihyu ba'Levanon, Shenayim Chodashim b'Veiso"?

(b)Why does ...

1. ... Rav decline to learn from Rebbi Yochanan's Pasuk?

2. ... Rebbi Yochanan decline to learn from Rav's Pasuk?

1)

(a)

1. Rav learns from the Pasuk Divrei ha'Yamim (regarding the servants of David ha'Melech) "l'Chol Devar ha'Machlokes Chodesh b'Chodesh ... " - that it is acceptable (to leave home with one's wife's permission) to study or to work for one month provided one then spends a month at home.

2. Rebbi Yochanan learns from the Pasuk in Melachim (regarding the building of the Beis ha'Mikdash) "Chodesh Yiheyu ba'Levanon, Shenayim Chodashim b'Veiso" - that one must spend at least two months for each month that one spends away from home.

(b)

1. Rav declines to learn from Rebbi Yochanan's Pasuk - because the Binyan Beis ha'Mikdash is different, seeing as thirty thousand people participated, whereas only ten thousand at a time were needed, allowing the workers more time at home.

2. Rebbi Yochanan declines to learn from Rav's Pasuk - because the king compensated the workers with various extras, thereby winning the women's approval to remain at home for shorter periods.

2)

(a)What does ...

1. ... Rav learn from the Pasuk in Yechezkel "v'Atah ben-Adam Ha'anach b'Shivron Mosnayim ... "?

2. ... Rebbi Yochanan learn from the Pasuk there (regarding the destruction of the Beis ha'Mikdash) " ... al Mah Ata Ne'enach, v'Amarta, el Shemu'ah Ki Va'ah, v'Namas Kol Lev, v'Rafu Kol Yadayim, v'Chahasah Kol Ru'ach v'Chol Birkayim Teilachnah Mayim"?

(b)Why does ...

1. ... Rebbi Yochanan decline to learn from Rav's Pasuk?

2. ... Rav decline to learn from Rebbi Yochanan's Pasuk?

(c)Why did the Nochri mention the Beis Hamikdash to the Jew with whom he was walking?

(d)What did the Jew reply to the Nochri, when he expressed surprise at the fact that his statement seemed to have had no effect, and that the Jew continued to walk as fast as before?

2)

(a)

1. Rav learns from the Pasuk in Yechezkel "v'Atah ben-Adam Ha'anach b'Shivron Mosnayim ... " - that sighing breaks half a person's body.

2. Rebbi Yochanan learn from the Pasuk there (regarding the destruction of the Beis ha'Mikdash) " ... al Mah Ata Ne'enach, v'Amarta, el Shemu'ah Ki Va'ah, v'Namas Kol Lev, v'Rafu Kol Yadayim, v'Chahasah Kol Ru'ach, v'Chol Birkayim Teilachnah Mayim" - that sighing breaks the entire body.

(b)

1. Rebbi Yochanan declines to learn from Rav's Pasuk - because he interprets the Pasuk to mean that the break-up begins from the loins.

2. Rav decline to learns from Rebbi Yochanan's Pasuk - because, he says, a sigh following the destruction of the Beis Hamikdash is worse than a sigh for any other reason.

(c)The Nochri mentioned the Beis ha'Mikdash to the Jew with whom he was walking - because he was unable to keep up with him, and he hoped that the sigh that the mention of the Beis ha'Mikdash was bound to elicit, would weaken the Jew sufficiently for him to be able to now keep abreast with him (seeing as we just learned that sighing breaks half the body).

(d)The Jew answered him however - that that only applied to a fresh sorrow, but not to an old one like that of the Churban Beis ha'Mikdash.

3)

(a)If the Pasuk in Tehilim "Shav Lachem Mashkimei Kum ... Ochlei Lechem ha'Atzavim" refers to people who are earning a Parnasah, how does Rav Yitzchak interpret the continuation of the Pasuk "Ken Yiten li'Yedido Sheinah"? To whom does that refer?

(b)Why did this cause Abaye to reject Rava's contention that the Tayalim referred to in our Mishnah (whose Onah is every day) pertains to Talmidim who learn with their Rebbe in their hometown, and who sleep at home?

(c)So Abaye citing Rav, pointed to Rav Shmuel bar Shilas. What was Rav Shmuel bar Shilas' profession? Why was he the epitome of someone whose Onah is every day?

(d)What is the significance of the statement 'v'Lo Chalif Pristeka d'Malka a'Bavei'?

3)

(a)The Pasuk in Tehilim "Shav Lachem Mashkimei Kum ... Ochlei Lechem ha'Atzavim" refers to people who are earning a Parnasah; whereas Rav Yitzchak interprets the continuation of the Pasuk "Ken Yiten li'Yedido Sheinah" - to the wives of Talmidei-Chachamim, who shake sleep from their eyes waiting for their husbands to return from the Beis-ha'Medrash late at night.

(b)This caused Abaye to reject Rava's contention that the Tayalim referred to in our Mishnah (whose Onah is every day) pertains to Talmidim who learn with their Rebbe in their hometown, and who sleep at home - because we now see that when it is bed-time for other people, the Talmidim are still in the Beis-ha'Midrash, and not at home, like we first thought.

(c)So Abaye citing Rav, pointed to Rav Shmuel bar Shilas - who was a Melamed Tinokos (a children's Rebbe). He was the epitome of someone whose Onah is every day - because he had a good income, so he ate well and drank well, and he slept every night at home.

(d)'v'Lo Chalif Peristeka d'Malka a'Bavei' means - that in addition to the above, the government did not trouble him for a work-tax, because they did not consider him wealthy, so they left him alone.

4)

(a)Ravin cited the Mefanki Ma'arva as people who were Chayav Onah every day. Who were the 'Mefanki Ma'arva'?

(b)Rebbi Avahu was supported by two Avadim in the bathhouse, and Rebbi Yochanan, by Rav Ami and Rav Asi (this should probably be Rebbi Ami and Rebbi Asi) as he climbed a ladder. What else did they both have in common?

(c)How do we know that they were incredibly strong?

(d)How did Rebbi Yochanan explain the fact that he had two men supporting him in spite of his phenomenal strength?

4)

(a)Ravin cited the Mefanki Ma'arva as people who were Chayav Onah every day. These were - wealthy men who live in Eretz Yisrael, who ate and drank well (so they were strong and healthy) and who slept every night at home.

(b)Rebbi Avahu was supported by two Avadim in the bathhouse, and Rebbi Yochanan, by Rav Ami and Rav Asi (this should probably be Rebbi Ami and Rebbi Asi) as he climbed a ladder. Both were actually extremely strong and did not require support.

(c)We know that they were incredibly strong - because when the floor of the bathhouse caved in and Rebbi Avahu fell with his two supporters, he caught hold of a pole, and skimmed up the pole carrying them with him; and when the ladder broke under Rebbi Yochanan, he climbed to the top using one hand, whilst holding Rav Ami and Rav Asi with the other.

(d)Rebbi Yochanan explained that, in spite of his phenomenal strength, he had two men supporting him - in order to preserve his strength for his old age, when he would have more need of it.

5)

(a)How does Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Chanina reconcile our Mishnah ('ha'Po'alim Shtayim b'Shabbos) with the Beraisa which states 'Achas b'Shabbos'?

(b)What proof do we have that this answer is correct?

5)

(a)Rebbi Yosi b'Rebbi Chanina reconciles our Mishnah ('ha'Po'alim Shtayim b'Shabbos') with the Beraisa which states 'Achas b'Shabbos' - by establishing the former when the worker works in his hometown, and the latter, when he works out of town (only returning home each second day).

(b)The proof that this answer is correct lies - in the fact that it is supported by a Beraisa.

6)

(a)Why did Rav Chanan assume that the Din of 'ha'Madir' in our Mishnah is confined to a Tayal (which we explained earlier on the Amud), and a laborer?

(b)How did Abaye disillusion him?

(c)Why should that be, considering that the Onah of a sailor, to quote the most extreme case, is only once every six months?

(d)Rava bar Rav Chanan asked Abaye whether an ass-driver is permitted to became a camel-driver without his wife's express permission (seeing as, on the one hand, his income increases, whereas on the other, his Onah decreases). What did the latter reply?

6)

(a)Rav Chanan assumed that the Din of 'ha'Madir' in our Mishnah is confined to a Tayal (which we explained earlier on the Amud), and a laborer - since they are the only ones who will be practically affected by the week that the Neder lasts (since even an ass-driver will only lose one night).

(b)Abaye disillusioned him however - by informing him that it pertains to all the cases in the Mishnah, even a sailor, whose Onah only falls due once a month ...

(c)... due to the principle 'One cannot compare someone who has bread in his basket (who could perhaps come home early and be intimate with his wife within the regular time-period) with someone who does not (on account of his Neder)'.

(d)Rava bar Rav Chanan asked Abaye whether an ass-driver is permitted to became a camel-driver without his wife's express permission (seeing as, on the one hand, his income increases, whereas on the other, his Onah decreases). He replied - that a woman prefers more intimacy and less income than the other way round. Consequently, it is forbidden.

62b----------------------------------------62b

7)

(a)Rav B'runa Amar Rav rules like Rebbi Eliezer (in our Mishnah), who gives all the prescribed Shiurim for Onah. According to Rav Ada bar Ahavah Amar Rav, what do the Chachamim say about Talmidim?

(b)The Rabanan relied on Rav Ada bar Ahavah's ruling. When did Rav Rechumi, Rava's Talmid in Mechoza, used to arrive home from Kollel each year?

(c)He was once sitting on the roof and the roof caved-in, killing him. Why did this happen to him?

7)

(a)Rav Bruna Amar Rav rules like Rebbi Eliezer (in our Mishnah), who gives all the prescribed Shi'urim for Onah. According to Rav Ada bar Ahavah Amar Rav, the Chachamim permit Talmidim to go and learn away from home for even as long as two or three years, without permission.

(b)The Rabanan relied on Rav Ada bar Ahavah's ruling. Rav Rechumi, Rava's Talmid in Mechoza, used to arrive home from Yeshiva each year - on Erev Yom Kippur.

(c)He was once sitting on the roof and the roof caved-in, killing him - as a punishment for the tears that his wife shed when he failed to arrive that year on Erev Yom Kippur, because he became deeply involved in his learning.

8)

(a)What Onah does Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel give for Talmidei-Chachamim?

(b)What does Rav Yehudah (or Rav Huna or Rav Nachman) learn from the Pasuk in Tehilim "Asher Piryo Yiten b'Ito"?

(c)What caused Rebbi Yanai to tell the people of his household to overturn the bed of Yehudah brei d'Rebbi Chiya (his son-in-law)'s bed one Erev Shabbos?

(d)What really happened?

(e)What happened next, based on the Pasuk in Koheles "ki'Shegagah she'Yotzei mi'Pi ha'Shalit"?

8)

(a)Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel gives the Shi'ur Onah for Talmidei-Chachamim - as every Friday night.

(b)Rav Yehudah (or Rav Huna or Rav Nachman) learns from the Pasuk "Asher Piryo Yiten b'Ito" - that a Talmid-Chacham who follows the ruling of Rav Yehudah Amar Rav will have children.

(c)Rebbi Yanai told the people of his household to overturn the bed of Yehudah b'rei d'Rebbi Chiya (his son-in-law)'s bed one Erev Shabbos - when the pillar of fire, that normally preceded his arrival home from Yeshiva, failed to appear. This led Rebbi Yanai to believe that he had died.

(d)What really happened was that like Rav Rechumi, he had become deeply involved in his learning, and had therefore failed to leave the Yeshiva for home).

(e)However, based on the Pasuk in Koheles "ki'Shegagah she'Yotzei mi'Pi ha'Shalit" - the moment Rebbi Yanai said that his son-in-law was dead, he died.

9)

(a)How did Rebbi react when, as his son was about to marry the daughter of Rebbi Chiya, the latter died?

(b)Who was Shefatyah ben Avital?

(c)What does he have to do with Rebbi?

(d)From whom did Rebbi Chiya descend?

9)

(a)When, as Rebbi's son was about to marry the daughter of Rebbi Chiya, the latter died - Rebbi suggested that there must be a flaw in Rebbi Chiya's family (because he was not a direct offspring of the family of Malchus Beis David - see Agados Maharsha).

(b)Shefatyah ben Avital was a son of David ha'Melech (seeing as Avital was one of his wives).

(c)Rebbi descended from him.

(d)Rebbi Chiya descended from - Shim'a Achi David, who was not from Malchus Beis David (see also Agados Maharsha).

10)

(a)On what condition did Rebbi eventually chose the daughter of Rebbi Yosi ben Zimra for his son?

(b)How did the Chasan react when they led his Kalah to be in front of him, twice?

(c)In what connection did Rebbi quote the two Pesukim "Tevi'emo v'Sita'emo" (Beshalach) and " v'Asu Li Mikdash ... " (Terumah)?

(d)So he married her first and then went to Yeshiva. By the time he returned, his wife had become barren. Why was that?

(e)Rebbi Davened for his daughter-in-law's recovery, and his prayer was answered. He would not have prayed for a miracle unless there was no other option. Why could his son not simply ...

1. ... have divorced her?

2. ... marry a second wife?

10)

(a)In the end Rebbi chose the daughter of Rebbi Yosi ben Zimra for his son - on condition that he would first spend twelve years in Yeshiva.

(b)When they led the Kalah to be in front of the Chasan the first time, he was so enamored with her, that he asked to reduce the twelve years in Yeshiva to six; and when they did so a second time, he asked to be allowed to marry her immediately, and go to Yeshiva afterwards.

(c)Rebbi quoted the two Pesukim "Tevi'emo v'Sita'emo" and " v'Asu Li Mikdash ... " - to point out that his son need not be embarrassed, since he was no different than Hash-m (kiv'Yachol), who also initially intended to build the Beis Hamikdash only after Yisrael entered Eretz Yisrael, but then became so enamored with Klal Yisrael, that he ordered them to build a Mishkan already in the desert (a proof for the Ramban, who maintains that the Mishkan was not merely to atone for the sin of the Golden Calf, but an institution in its own right [see Agados Maharsha]).

(d)So he married her first and went to Yeshiva afterwards. By the time he returned however, his wife had become barren - because that is what happens to a woman who lives ten years without a husband or with her husband.

(e)Rebbi Davened for his daughter-in-law's recovery, and his prayer was answered. He would not have prayed for a miracle unless there was no other option. His son could not simply ...

1. ... have divorced her - because it would not have been proper to repay his faithful wife in such a way.

2. ... marry a second wife - because then people would have referred to his second wife as his wife and his first wife as his prostitute.

11)

(a)How did Rebbi Chanina ben Chachinai react when Rebbi Shimon bar Yochai asked him to wait for the end of his son's Sheva Berachos, so that they could go to Yeshiva together?

(b)Upon his return, why did he sit on a bridge?

(c)How did he eventually discover the way to his house?

(d)His wife, who was sifting flour when he arrived home unexpectedly, looked up and died from shock when she saw him. What happened next?

11)

(a)When Rebbi Shimon bar Yochai asked Rebbi Chanina ben Chachinai to wait for the end of his son's Sheva Berachos, so that they could go to Yeshiva together - he responded by leaving for Yeshiva immediately, on his own.

(b)Upon his return, he sat on a bridge - because the town had changed so drastically that he did not know the way to his own house. So he sat on the bridge and waited.

(c)He eventually discovered the way to his house - by following a girl whom people referred to as bas Chachinai, and who must therefore have been his daughter.

(d)His wife, who was sifting flour when he arrived unexpectedly, looked up and died from shock when she saw him - Rebbi Chanina ben Chachinai prayed for Divine mercy, because, he said, she deserved a better reward than that for having suffered all the years that he was away, and she came back to life.

12)

(a)Rebbi Chama bar Bisa also went to Yeshiva for twelve years. What did he do to avoid making the same mistake as Rebbi Chanina bar Chachinai?

(b)What did he say when Rebbi Oshaya came and sat before him and began plying him with strong questions? Who was Rebbi Oshaya?

(c)Why did Rebbi Chama bar Bisa stand up when, after he arrived home, Rebbi Oshaya entered? What did his wife comment at that point?

(d)Why did Rami bar Chama quote the Pasuk in Koheles "v'ha'Chut ha'Meshulash Lo bi'Meheirah Yinasek"?

12)

(a)Rebbi Chama bar Bisa also went to Yeshiva for twelve years. To avoid making the same mistake as Rebbi Chanina bar Chachinai - he sent a message to his family that he had arrived, before actually going home.

(b)When Rebbi Oshaya his son (whom he did not recognize) came and sat before him and began plying him with strong questions - he expressed regret at having gone to Yeshiva instead of learning with his son, who would have turned out to be as astute as that young man.

(c)When, after Rebbi Chama bar Bisa arrived home, Rebbi Oshaya entered, he stood up - because he still did not know who he was, and thought that he had followed him home in order to ask him more questions. His wife commented at the phenomenon of a father standing up for his son.

(d)Rami bar Chama quoted the Pasuk "v'ha'Chut ha'Meshulash Lo bi'Meheirah Yinasek" - in connection with the family that had now produced three consecutive generations of Talmidei-Chachamim, Rebbi Bisa, Rebbi Chama and Rebbi Oshaya.